Are there health benefits for using coffee &/or tea?

[Minyan Man]

The reason I ask the question is because I went to the Doctor a while back and I during my exam, I told the doctor that I didn't like
side effects of a particular medication she prescribed me. It made me feel tired and listless. Her response was drink one additional
cup of coffee in the morning. She doesn't know that I am LDS. I don't think it would of made a difference if she did know. I think
her answer would of been the same. So I did a little research on my own.

Here is an article I found.
https://www.aarp.org/health/healthy-liv ... f%20Coffee

I know this is not new. I'm just wondering why the church is still holding on to the prohibition for not using either or bo!th.
Has anyone else gotten the same advice from a Doctor?
Does anyone know why they are still prohibited? Maybe it's because they don't want to admit the revelation was wrong?
Just curious!

[AmyJ]

I think it goes back to "why coffee and tea" outlawed in the WoW (also why sugar isn't). Mostly I think it's just that as a health code, it did not predict the rise of manufacturing, of sugar (real and fake), of potent chemicals, GMO, or a lot of things.

1980's and 1990's cultural thinking was "because" and "caffeine". That's why specific sodas were added to the banned list for some church members/families. The medical benefits of caffeine are there for the points in your article. Also, caffeine has been a poor man's version of ADHD medication management - usually most noticeable outside our religion.

What I am seeing is that no one has seriously asked for revelation to update the WoW - so we are stuck with what was written down and what our "interpretation" (personal and collective) is.

At a church meeting I saw a member in good standing chug down an iced green tea - and no one gave it a 2nd thought. I think that the culture is changing to a more "you do you" in terms of personal health code and what you say in temple recommend interviews.

[Old-Timer]

Benefits and negative effects, depending on each person and amount used - just like pretty much everything.

[DarkJedi]

Benefits and negative effects, depending on each person and amount used - just like pretty much everything.

I agree. Myriad studies show both, just like butter, eggs, bacon, and may other things. All things in moderation seems to work, unless of course you have individual reactions (allergies, sensitivities, etc.).

I consume caffeine daily, usually in the form of an energy drink. I don't like coffee and didn't drink it before joining the church. I did drink tea, and iced tea was the drink we had at meal times growing up (unsweetened, this was in the northeast). I have the occasional iced tea now. With this massive temple building project underway, ostensibly to bring temples closer to the people, and with what we hear from leaders about going to the temple, it would seem the leadership wants people to go to the temple. If you have the point of view that the temple brings blessings, the more people who have access to those blessings the better. Simply eliminating the "worthiness" question regarding the WoW would go a long way in allowing more people to take advantage of those blessings. (Changing tithing would also make a difference.)

[DarkJedi]

I think it goes back to "why coffee and tea" outlawed in the WoW (also why sugar isn't). Mostly I think it's just that as a health code, it did not predict the rise of manufacturing, of sugar (real and fake), of potent chemicals, GMO, or a lot of things.

1980's and 1990's cultural thinking was "because" and "caffeine". That's why specific sodas were added to the banned list for some church members/families. The medical benefits of caffeine are there for the points in your article. Also, caffeine has been a poor man's version of ADHD medication management - usually most noticeable outside our religion.

What I am seeing is that no one has seriously asked for revelation to update the WoW - so we are stuck with what was written down and what our "interpretation" (personal and collective) is.

At a church meeting I saw a member in good standing chug down an iced green tea - and no one gave it a 2nd thought. I think that the culture is changing to a more "you do you" in terms of personal health code and what you say in temple recommend interviews.

I do agree the culture is changing, and younger members especially are not so married to some of the more archaic ideas.

Historically, it's pretty clear Brigham Young expressly brought up coffee and tea probably had to do with the cost of importing those items to Salt Lake. Culturally, there was a belief in Joseph Smith's time that drinking or eating very hot things was not good for our bodies. There actually is some research to back that up. We should not drink or eat boiling hot stuff. I believe this is what section 89 was referring to.

[Minyan Man]

I know that this is a "left" turn from my own topic. Please be patient.
Before my crisis of faith, I was 100% in. I lived the gospel as best that
I could. I answered the TR questions with complete honesty.

Today if I wanted a TR & go to the temple, I would feel dishonest & guilty
answering this question with a "Yes".

The temple recommend interview questions include the following:
11.

Do you understand and obey the Word of Wisdom?

Because of being inactive for a period of time, I feel guilty about most gospel
teachings & beliefs. I'm not sure how to get through that issue in my life.

Here's another "left" turn. I have a phantasy: Jesus Christ comes to sacrament meeting. He comes
to the podium carrying a Starbuck's cup & starts his talk. How many people would be able to
concentrate on what He says & instead concentration on the cup of coffee in His hand?
I think a lot of times we are more interested in the appearance of holiness instead of judging ourselves or
others.

[AmyJ]

Before my faith transition, the church doctrine and culture was the framework I lived my life in.
When I was about 14, I had a serious ethical/moral qualm about procuring and eating "beer battered mozzarella sticks" from the grocery store.
[True Story - Laugh compassionately with me at my younger self].

My parents had many conversations with me about "the Letter of the Law" vs "the Spirit of the Law" and how to weave between both sides.

Shortly after my husband and I got married, some of his chronic illnesses kicked in and he couldn't sit through long periods of time in stuffy, perfume-saturated rooms. I didn't want to go without him and spend the time and resources there, and he couldn't go even if he wanted to. So we stopped.

I got a temple recommend back in 2018 as part of the Pathways program. The WoW question was the least of my concerns at that time of potential nihilism for me. My path has taken me out of sitting down for a temple recommend - likely for the rest of my life, and I am OK with that.

So younger you made choices at the time that attending church was a lower priority then other priorities - for a lot of specific reasons at the time. Younger you did the best they could under the circumstances to serve your best interests as they understood them to make the best choices available then. The guilt that you are holding onto makes it harder for your current self to metaphorically hug your younger self and weighs you down now. This is where Grace comes in - Grace from yourself and from the belief in the Atonement. Just because you were inactive then doesn't mean that you aren't "Worthy" to show up in community and in connection to God in some ways - and that maybe God might want to walk into a conversation with you about "Grace". I wouldn't know, but it wouldn't surprise me.

I think that Mark Twain got it right (in a less tongue-in-cheek-way then intended):
"God made Man in His Own Image - and Man being man, decided to return the Favor".

People "play God" all the time and make all kinds of judgements about other people - to make themselves feel better and to distract themselves from the work they need to be doing on themselves. It's a feature of forming communities, not a temporary bug.

The only judgement that matters is yours, what you feel God decides with you, consequences of your decisions, and judgements made in your immediate household (spouse and children usually). Not a bunch of policy makers who wrote down a list of questions 50 years ago (or who knows when exactly) to codify the temple questions. Not the male leader in front of you who wants to honor his calling and get on with his life - so he has to ask you a bunch of questions.

[Minyan Man]

AmyJ, I like the way you think. I know I make like far more complicated than it has to be.
I'm sure that God is far more understanding than I give him credit for.