General Conference - Fall 2023

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Old-Timer
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General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by Old-Timer »

As normal, there have been talks that will be appreciated and disliked by us here. This is a generic thread to discuss general thoughts and feelings about this conference.

My initial takeaway thus far, is that there have been some really good talks so far, even with some which I do not see positively.

In particular, the talk I currently am watching, by Elder Soares, is phenomenal (joining my all-time favorites) and will be one I reference often.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by Old-Timer »

Elder Ballard’s talk began with the statement that he is losing his eyesight. He spoke slowly and simply. It sounded like a farewell address. It was a simple testimony, and it was touching.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken
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PazamaManX
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by PazamaManX »

Old-Timer wrote: 01 Oct 2023, 09:27 Elder Ballard’s talk began with the statement that he is losing his eyesight. He spoke slowly and simply. It sounded like a farewell address. It was a simple testimony, and it was touching.
I did get the sense from the end of his talk that he felt like this could be his last one. At least that is how it sounded from how he was speaking.

I didn't realize he was in his 90s. He doesn't look it.
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness, even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." ~ Thomas Jefferson
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by Old-Timer »

Elder Giraud-Carrier’s talk is wonderful. He laid it on the line, bluntly.

If we lived what he just preached, we would be a much better people.

Seriously, this might be my new favorite General Conference talk ever - and that is saying a lot.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by Old-Timer »

Pres. Nelson’s talk is one many here will want to avoid. The concept of “Think Celestial” is one I like, but the application of it in the talk is not the way I see the phrase.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken
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PazamaManX
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by PazamaManX »

My thoughts:

I love love loved Uchtdorf's talk! By far my favorite of the conference and it's not even close. I definitely felt the warm-fuzzies with that one.

Most talks I thought were "meh". Pretty run-of-the-mill and did not move the needle for me one way or the other.

I disliked Pingree's talk on truth. I thought that whole talk was pretty poor all around. My thoughts differ from Old-Timer on Giraud-Carrier’s talk. It had a good message, but his tone and spirit was grating to me.

Both Gong and Pres. Nelson's talks were mixed bags for me. Gong was doing so well with the 'short skirt' story, and then his talk went downhill when he got into accepting callings. With Nelson's, I thought his comment on addictions offending God was tone deaf. I would've expected better from a former medical professional. His "Think Celestial" bit felt like "Ask the missionaries" all over again.

Something else I noticed about this conference was how hurried it felt. Many speakers began rattling their talks off the second they hit the pulpit. I don't know if they were behind schedule, nervous, or what, but it detracted from the calm mood that you would expect from GC.
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness, even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." ~ Thomas Jefferson
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nibbler
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by nibbler »

Interesting. We've all got different ways things hit us. I thought it was one of DFU's worst talks, even one of the worst talks of the conference. I say this for two reasons:
  1. I can envision his talk being weaponized and used against people that have left the church.
  2. He gave the "Come, Join with Us" talk 10 years ago. October 2013. In that talk he mentioned that people often erroneously assume that people leave the church out of a desire to sin or out of laziness. So what does DFU say in this talk... well not so much say outright but imply?
    • People leave the church to get out from under the rules of the church (aka, a desire to sin).
    • People on the outside mistakenly believe that they are living their best life, they are not. Even mocks people a bit for believing it.
    • Eventually people on the outside will fail because they're on the outside.
    • The pot-shots taken at the communities that are accepting and validating of the person that has left.
    • The pot-shots taken at the person that left for imagining that they've found a better community.
    • Your soul is empty outside the church.
    • People that leave the church are miserable and could be too embarrassed to return.
    • Eventually the hardships and false friends will humble them enough so they'll come crawling back.
Now... I don't recall him saying the word "church" in his parable. May have, maybe not, I didn't catch the nuance. Maybe he even specifically said leaving the presence of god, not the church, and in his mind he has clear line of distinction between the church and god, meaning the talk was about leaving moral living behind and I just read leaving the church into it. Again I don't recall the specifics.

I also concede that he could have been speaking to people that leave the church for one very specific reason and I'm reading a broad brush into his talk. If he meant it to be very targeted, he didn't say so.

What he said and how it will be consumed are two separate things. He may have been focused on people that leave moral living behind but I fear that's not what orthodox members will hear. Church culture is primed to believe that leaving the church behind equates to leaving moral living behind. I fear the talk will be weaponized and it's almost a 180 from his "Come, Join with Us" talk from 10 years ago.

I felt his talk from 10 years ago was welcoming. This most recent talk didn't feel welcoming, it felt judgmental.
If you erase the mistakes of your past, you would also erase all the wisdom of your present. Remember the lesson, not the disappointment.
— I dunno
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PazamaManX
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by PazamaManX »

nibbler wrote: 01 Oct 2023, 18:17
Now... I don't recall him saying the word "church" in his parable. May have, maybe not, I didn't catch the nuance. Maybe he even specifically said leaving the presence of god, not the church, and in his mind he has clear line of distinction between the church and god, meaning the talk was about leaving moral living behind and I just read leaving the church into it. Again I don't recall the specifics.

I also concede that he could have been speaking to people that leave the church for one very specific reason and I'm reading a broad brush into his talk. If he meant it to be very targeted, he didn't say so.

What he said and how it will be consumed are two separate things. He may have been focused on people that leave moral living behind but I fear that's not what orthodox members will hear. Church culture is primed to believe that leaving the church behind equates to leaving moral living behind. I fear the talk will be weaponized and it's almost a 180 from his "Come, Join with Us" talk from 10 years ago.
I believe he did say "church" once (to my recollection). But 'presence of God' is the meaning I got out of it and what I assume his intention was. Perhaps my own sense of distinction between God and church led me to appreciate the message rather than feeling targeted. To me, this talk felt like a sequel to 'Come, Join with Us'.

Though, I can see how others might not like it. The potential for members to weaponize it is real. But a lot of GC talks have that potential. As you mentioned, it comes down to how people hear it.

It will be interesting next Sunday to find out what the TBMs heard in conference. I think in addition to my usual tracking of scripture vs GA references, I'll have to keep track of how many times I hear, "Think Celestial." Then, when I get home, I'll drink a shot of coffee for each one :mrgreen:
"Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness, even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." ~ Thomas Jefferson
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by Minyan Man »

It would be interesting to know how many times "Covenant Path" was used in the talks.

Now the new phrase will be "Think Celestial".

I know I'm old but canned phrases annoy me.
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Re: General Conference - Fall 2023

Post by nibbler »

It's my fault. I used a monkey paw wish to rid us once and for all of the phrase covenant path but, as we all know, the monkey paw always wins in the end. Covenant path will only go away because celestial thinking will take its place.
If you erase the mistakes of your past, you would also erase all the wisdom of your present. Remember the lesson, not the disappointment.
— I dunno
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