Good-Bye, Dad

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Life_Journey_of_Matt
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by Life_Journey_of_Matt » 07 Nov 2013, 19:44

My condolences, Ray. All of my best thoughts go out to you and your family.
"So oft in theologic wars / The disputants, I ween, / Rail on in utter ignorance / Of what each other mean / And prate about an Elephant / Not one of them has seen." -- from "The Blind Men and the Elephant" by John Godfrey Saxe

"The faith that stands on authority is not faith. The reliance on authority measures the decline of religion, the withdrawal of the soul." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

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Curt Sunshine
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by Curt Sunshine » 08 Nov 2013, 14:02

I sent an email to my daughter's Mission President explaining what had happened and asking him to talk with her about it - to make sure she hears about it in a setting different than the internet cafe where she accesses emails on P-Day. I mentioned that I lost a grandfather while on my mission, but she now has lost both of hers in less than two months.

A few minutes ago, he called my cell phone and told me he had called and talked extensively with her. He gave me a phone number where we can reach her. He said she is waiting for our call. My wife is on the phone with her as I am typing this.

I want to share a small part of our conversation, just because it hit me that I should.

He mentioned how much he loves my daughter, and he said, "I know how much she needs to talk with family right now, since I've lost both of my sons already. If I'm feeling down about something, I know I can call her. She will cheer me up every time. I need to return that favor." I told him that I describe her as a "force of nature", and he laughed - then said, "That's a great description."

I know there are issues with individual church leaders, but most of them are good, caring, kind people doing the best they can - and I am really grateful right now that her Mission President is one them.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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DarkJedi
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by DarkJedi » 08 Nov 2013, 14:51

What a wonderful story, Ray. I agree that most church leaders are good people doing their best, and most of them also have a heart and some common sense. I'm glad your daughter's mission president is one of those.

I am sorry for your multiple losses, my thoughts are with you brother.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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afterall
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by afterall » 10 Nov 2013, 18:48

So sorry Ray! I have not been able to really be here for a bit, so just now seeing this. My prayers are going up for your whole family.

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cwald
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by cwald » 10 Nov 2013, 19:23

-sigh-

Yeah, this is the life we live.

I lost my grandfather, who I was named after, while on a mission. That haunted me for many years....not being there with family I mean.

My thoughts are with you and your family.

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  Jesus gave us the gospel, but Satan invented church. It takes serious evil to formalize faith into something tedious and then pile guilt on anyone who doesn't participate enthusiastically. - Robert Kirby

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cwald
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by cwald » 10 Nov 2013, 19:25

...And good for the mission president...these stories need to be told more.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
  Jesus gave us the gospel, but Satan invented church. It takes serious evil to formalize faith into something tedious and then pile guilt on anyone who doesn't participate enthusiastically. - Robert Kirby

Curt Sunshine
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by Curt Sunshine » 25 Nov 2013, 21:55

My father-in-law officially passed away about an hour ago. (Long story about what has happened over the past two weeks that I might share at some point.) I have been nearly absent from this forum for the past few days helping attend to his passing.

At some point, after the immediate family has had a chance to post publicly, I will share some details that I hold dear. Suffice it to say at this point that it ended peacefully, with nearly all of the immediate family able to say good-bye personally, even if he couldn't respond.

Grieving celebration, mixed liberally with humor, can be a wonderful thing. The hospital staff unanimously was uplifted by seeing the generational effect of a man who believed laughter was better than crying. (For example, one of his sons said that a stroke getting off the toilet was a crappy way to go, and my oldest son said having a stroke seemed like a one-sided action. Nearly a week of stuff like that . . . ) If he was aware of us the last few days, I'm sure he appreciated the humorous atmosphere that surrounded his passing.

He and I saw lots of things very differently (and I mean VERY differently), but he was a better man in many ways than I am. As I said about my own father almost exactly two months ago:

The world lost a good man tonight.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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DarkJedi
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by DarkJedi » 26 Nov 2013, 10:25

Wow, Ray, you have been through a lot of late. I did notice your absence and wondered if this is what was happening, having read about your experience with your daughter's mission president. My condolences to you and your family.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

Ann
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by Ann » 26 Nov 2013, 11:25

Ray Degraw wrote:
Grieving celebration, mixed liberally with humor, can be a wonderful thing. The hospital staff unanimously was uplifted by seeing the generational effect of a man who believed laughter was better than crying. (For example, one of his sons said that a stroke getting off the toilet was a crappy way to go, and my oldest son said having a stroke seemed like a one-sided action. Nearly a week of stuff like that . . . ) If he was aware of us the last few days, I'm sure he appreciated the humorous atmosphere that surrounded his passing.
Sorry for your family's loss, Ray. I love how we still can't help laughing with our families in these circumstances.
"Preachers err by trying to talk people into belief; better they reveal the radiance of their own discovery." - Joseph Campbell

"The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes." - Marcel Proust

"Therefore they said unto him, How were thine eyes opened? He answered and said unto them, A man that is called Jesus made clay, and anointed my eyes...." - John 9:10-11

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SamBee
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Re: Good-Bye, Dad

Post by SamBee » 26 Nov 2013, 13:07

Condolences at this time again, Ray.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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