Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

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DarkJedi
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by DarkJedi » 26 Mar 2021, 08:57

The thought just occurred me. Manti is the temple with the dinosaurs (creation room). The church has said that Tiechert's murals would be preserved but I'm not sure she painted the dinosaurs. What is to become of them?

Link to old thread where the dinosaurs were discussed which contains a link to an article about them: viewtopic.php?t=4460. (Note that in those days I was not a moderator and while I do recognize I can be very blunt sometimes I do moderate myself as a moderator. I was just a loudmouth guy then.)
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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On Own Now
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by On Own Now » 04 May 2021, 12:15

Update regarding the Manti Temple and its renovation:

“As we have continued to seek the direction of the Lord on this matter,” President Nelson said, “we have been impressed to modify our earlier plans for the Manti Utah Temple so that the pioneer craftsmanship, artwork and character will be preserved, including the painted murals loved by so many. We will leave those murals where they are located now — inside the Manti Utah Temple.”

Presumably, in order to keep the pioneer form of the Manti Temple, and yet accommodate the area with a larger temple capacity, RMN has announced a temple in Ephraim.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... renovation

According to RAR at the end of the following video, this modification to earlier plans regarding Manti and the new Ephraim Temple resulted from a revelation from Jesus Christ.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6oIoQzYxOy0
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“Everything that irritates us about others can lead us to an understanding of ourselves.” ― Carl Jung
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"Let us therefore no longer pass judgment on one another, but resolve instead never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of another." ― Romans 14:13
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Roy
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by Roy » 04 May 2021, 13:48

I had heard about this. Wonderful news!

I am very content and pleased that the top church leadership have "continued to seek direction of the Lord." It is my belief (and also church doctrine) that the Lord has much yet to reveal to us. Remaining humble enough to understand that we do not already have all the answers is a prerequisite for gaining this further light and knowledge.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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DarkJedi
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by DarkJedi » 04 May 2021, 15:00

On Own Now wrote:
04 May 2021, 12:15
Update regarding the Manti Temple and its renovation:

“As we have continued to seek the direction of the Lord on this matter,” President Nelson said, “we have been impressed to modify our earlier plans for the Manti Utah Temple so that the pioneer craftsmanship, artwork and character will be preserved, including the painted murals loved by so many. We will leave those murals where they are located now — inside the Manti Utah Temple.”

Presumably, in order to keep the pioneer form of the Manti Temple, and yet accommodate the area with a larger temple capacity, RMN has announced a temple in Ephraim.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... renovation

According to RAR at the end of the following video, this modification to earlier plans regarding Manti and the new Ephraim Temple resulted from a revelation from Jesus Christ.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6oIoQzYxOy0
First and foremost I am pleased with the decision.

This is the first time I have heard Rasband use the revelation card. He did couch it a bit and used it in "I believe" statements. That said, my cynical side says if this was really revelation, why didn't God say something before they announced the bad plan? I recognize there is an element of "We heard you" here, but why is it so hard for them to just say, "Yeah, we heard you and you're right that was a bad plan. How's this one?" It's also interesting how the church has been getting some pushback of late, especially in Utah. There was the whole Tooele temple/development thing and there has been some stuff about various properties in the Salt Lake area. But at least they are listening- I'm not sure this would have happened 20 years ago.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

Roy
Posts: 6291
Joined: 07 Oct 2010, 14:16
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by Roy » 05 May 2021, 14:59

I suppose there are no real downsides to playing the revelation card and it might be hard to overuse.

Revelation is highly subjective so it is not ever anything that can be proven wrong.
DarkJedi wrote:
04 May 2021, 15:00
That said, my cynical side says if this was really revelation, why didn't God say something before they announced the bad plan?


The church has a long history of revelation leading to failure and then us adjusting the understanding of what God's intent must have been for the revelation in the first place (IOW "God must have wanted for us to learn from our failures" or "God must have wanted to achieve this silver lining side benefit"). Many church members are already accustomed to these sort of shifting goals and speculation on God's intent. Polygamy and the Priesthood and Temple Restriction are two famous examples. This is small potatoes compared to that.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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DarkJedi
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by DarkJedi » 06 May 2021, 04:45

Roy wrote:
05 May 2021, 14:59
The church has a long history of revelation leading to failure and then us adjusting the understanding of what God's intent must have been for the revelation in the first place (IOW "God must have wanted for us to learn from our failures" or "God must have wanted to achieve this silver lining side benefit"). Many church members are already accustomed to these sort of shifting goals and speculation on God's intent. Polygamy and the Priesthood and Temple Restriction are two famous examples. This is small potatoes compared to that.
A really big one early on in the church was the Kirtland bank fiasco. The first big exodus from the church happened as a result.

I agree that some of the faithful are used to it, and many just don't pay attention or care. I wouldn't have known Rasband played the revelation card if it was pointed out here. And most of us outside Utah are like "Another Utah temple? Ho hum." From my own point of view it smacks of too much aplologetics especially since a portion of the membership see the prophet as infallible.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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nibbler
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Re: Deeply disappointed about this development (SLC Temple)

Post by nibbler » 06 May 2021, 14:54

If members take the name of Jesus upon themselves when they are baptized then I'd say yes, Jesus did tell them to change their original plans.
I'm not running away. Im already gone.
— Kami Garcia

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