New but not new.

Public forum, tell us about yourself and what brings you to StayLDS!
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DarkJedi
Posts: 7664
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: New but not new.

Post by DarkJedi » 20 Apr 2022, 07:53

catlady wrote:
16 Apr 2022, 19:21
I do really like the use of the phrase "faith transition" rather than "crisis of faith". It is softer somehow and feels hopeful.
I agree. But it should also be pointed out that while for some people they're the same, for others the crisis is a very real and often very painful process, and very very much a crisis that precedes a transition. For some the transition is away from religion.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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LDS_Scoutmaster
Posts: 307
Joined: 21 Jan 2015, 23:30
Location: SoCal

Re: New but not new.

Post by LDS_Scoutmaster » 20 Apr 2022, 09:43

Welcome to the safe place! I was a long time lurker before joining and eventually posting as well. It has been immensely helpful to have a place where I can ask questions, get feedback, etc without worrying family members about my standing in the church , state of my soul, etc.

A lot of what you said resonates with me as well, I wasn't always a member, but the changes were the same.
DarkJedi wrote:
20 Apr 2022, 07:53
catlady wrote:
16 Apr 2022, 19:21
I do really like the use of the phrase "faith transition" rather than "crisis of faith". It is softer somehow and feels hopeful.
I agree. But it should also be pointed out that while for some people they're the same, for others the crisis is a very real and often very painful process that precedes a transition. For some the transition is away from religion.
I prefer 'faith evolution' personally. Coming from a nonmember perspective I had some really terrifying experiences when I thought about eternity and what happens after this life. Growing up in Catholicism, being agnostic off and on, with and without the church I've had my faith evolve throughout my life. Some scary moments, some beautifully unifying moments.

I agree it has been hard to find where to 'be' in the church, half of my children don't go, I am at odds at time with doctrine and dogma, culture, etc. But I also realized that there are probably people like me right in my own small little ward that I don't know what they are going through.

I feel like I can be at peace with whatever level I decide to participate, after all the church is there for me, not the other way around.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6311&start=70#p121051 My last talk

We are all imperfect beings, dealing with other imperfect beings, and we're doing it imperfectly.

catlady
Posts: 5
Joined: 10 Oct 2020, 19:33

Re: New but not new.

Post by catlady » 20 Apr 2022, 19:05

DarkJedi wrote:
20 Apr 2022, 07:53
catlady wrote:
16 Apr 2022, 19:21
I do really like the use of the phrase "faith transition" rather than "crisis of faith". It is softer somehow and feels hopeful.
I agree. But it should also be pointed out that while for some people they're the same, for others the crisis is a very real and often very painful process, and very very much a crisis that precedes a transition. For some the transition is away from religion.

catlady
Posts: 5
Joined: 10 Oct 2020, 19:33

Re: New but not new.

Post by catlady » 20 Apr 2022, 19:20

:crazy: I'm an idiot. I completely lost my comment after I reviewed it. In a nutshell I said that yes the faith crisis was real and painful for me also. And it still is at times as it has left a hole. I've been dealing with this for several years. The softening has come through time as I realize something can be good and worthwhile even if it isn't the same as I once believed.

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DarkJedi
Posts: 7664
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: New but not new.

Post by DarkJedi » 20 Apr 2022, 19:57

catlady wrote:
20 Apr 2022, 19:20
:crazy: I'm an idiot. I completely lost my comment after I reviewed it. In a nutshell I said that yes the faith crisis was real and painful for me also. And it still is at times as it has left a hole. I've been dealing with this for several years. The softening has come through time as I realize something can be good and worthwhile even if it isn't the same as I once believed.
That's happened to me too. Type out a perfect response and poof, it disappears into cyberspace. :roll:

My experience was similar. I spent years in crisis mode but when I recognized I really do believe in a God of some sort (at least as Creator), and that the church and the gospel are not the same thing I do recognize that the church has value, but different value than I used to think. The church is a tool to use along the path, it is not the path.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

catlady
Posts: 5
Joined: 10 Oct 2020, 19:33

Re: New but not new.

Post by catlady » 20 Apr 2022, 20:03

AmyJ wrote:
11 Apr 2022, 08:14
catlady wrote:
09 Apr 2022, 20:53
About this time I learned that there were several accounts of Joseph, Smith's first vision. I remember I was sitting outside of the Bishop's office at church waiting for an appointment. I looked up and saw the painting portraying Joseph's first vision and I had the strangest thing happen. It was like a huge shift of perspective in my brain. I no longer saw things the same way. It was weird and it was real.
Are you comfortable sharing with us what changed in your perspective please? Why are you defining it as "weird"?

This is a personal sore spot/uncomfortable itching spot (metaphorically) for me because thinking about Joseph Smith's different versions is not something that I can emotionally understand, and it is not a comfortable (though more comfortable) fit for me intellectually. I think that I can learn from your experience, if you are willing to share it.
I will try and answer your question although it is kind of hard to explain. It was a sudden shift in my perspective as I looked at the painting. All my life from Primary up through Seminary and Sunday School classes I had been taught about Joseph's prayer and "The first vision". About the year 2013 I learn about the other versions. This was disturbing to me. I mean wouldn't all those different details be somewhat important? And then that sudden shift came as a thought "what if.......this whole thing isn't true?" I used the term weird because it was so sudden, like a eureka moment, you know?

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LDS_Scoutmaster
Posts: 307
Joined: 21 Jan 2015, 23:30
Location: SoCal

Re: New but not new.

Post by LDS_Scoutmaster » 16 May 2022, 14:55

I think many members had the same feeling with how the BOM was portrayed as being translated and then finding out that there was a hat and stone involved.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6311&start=70#p121051 My last talk

We are all imperfect beings, dealing with other imperfect beings, and we're doing it imperfectly.

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Gerald
Posts: 463
Joined: 29 Sep 2011, 04:57

Re: New but not new.

Post by Gerald » 29 May 2022, 05:46

I'm a little late in responding to your original post but welcome all the same. I wanted to say that I also have a temple recommend and my "faith crisis" (for me it's been an evolution of faith I guess) has been entirely internal and secret. To the outside world, I'm probably still the faithful member that I always was. My wife is the only one who has some inkling that things are not precisely as they were but it makes her so uncomfortable that I don't discuss it much with her. I'm not planning on leaving the Church anyhow and I'm somewhat reserved and so keeping things to myself is fairly natural. In any event, this is definitely a safe space (in my experience) whatever your faith status may be. Again welcome.
So through the dusk of dead, blank-legended And unremunerative years we search to get where life begins, and still we groan because we do not find the living spark where no spark ever was; and thus we die, still searching, like poor old astronomers who totter off to bed and go to sleep, to dream of untriangulated stars.
---Edwin Arlington Robinson---

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SilentDawning
Posts: 7401
Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: New but not new.

Post by SilentDawning » 29 May 2022, 19:33

Welcome -- I know that feeling when one day you wake up and look at the church in a whole different way. For me there was a sense of loss but also a sense of freedom.

I've been posting here for over 10 years and so far no one has identified me. Whenever I refer to StayLDS to people in real life, I always call it "a private discussion forum to which I was invited".

So long as you don't let anyone know you post here, I trust your experience will be the same :)

Welcome to the site!
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

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