Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

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cwald
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Re: Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by cwald » 04 Oct 2013, 17:19

Alright. I won't push it...at least not in this thread.

:-)

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  Jesus gave us the gospel, but Satan invented church. It takes serious evil to formalize faith into something tedious and then pile guilt on anyone who doesn't participate enthusiastically. - Robert Kirby

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mackay11
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Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by mackay11 » 04 Oct 2013, 22:50

cwald wrote:Alright. I won't push it...at least not in this thread.

:-)

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Lol. I enjoy you being here :)

That's the closest we'll get to an official climb-down.

Apparently "Sorry/I was wrong" really are the hardest words (is that a song?)

Even so, when I've shared with some members they've freaked out. "But, how can he say forget what I said? He's an apostle and speaks through revelation."

That's the main thing I'm getting at. Some members just can't handle the clear implications of the leaders "prophesying in part" and "speaking through a glass darkly." They erroneously believe the Mormon prophets are exempt.

And as much as I want the leaders to go out of their way to teach people about their limitations, I want the happiness and stability of my TBM friends more.

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Life_Journey_of_Matt
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Re: Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by Life_Journey_of_Matt » 10 Oct 2013, 20:14

Wow, it took me an hour to get to the end of this thread, but I did it.

I would just like to add one thing:
3) We don’t have all the answers.
What would be more meaningful to me is an admission that the answers we think we DO have may not all be right. IMO these are two different things.
"So oft in theologic wars / The disputants, I ween, / Rail on in utter ignorance / Of what each other mean / And prate about an Elephant / Not one of them has seen." -- from "The Blind Men and the Elephant" by John Godfrey Saxe

"The faith that stands on authority is not faith. The reliance on authority measures the decline of religion, the withdrawal of the soul." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

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Orson
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Re: Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by Orson » 10 Oct 2013, 20:45

Life_Journey_of_Matt wrote:What would be more meaningful to me is an admission that the answers we think we DO have may not all be right.
Yes, that is the Pandora's box. It is obvious to me that the realization of this idea is what defines an invisible divide in the church.
My avatar - both physical and spiritual.

I first found faith, and thought I had all truth. I then discovered doubt, and claimed a more accurate truth. Now I’ve greeted paradox and a deeper truth than I have ever known.

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cwald
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Re: Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by cwald » 10 Oct 2013, 21:29

Orson wrote:
Life_Journey_of_Matt wrote:What would be more meaningful to me is an admission that the answers we think we DO have may not all be right.
Yes, that is the Pandora's box. It is obvious to me that the realization of this idea is what defines an invisible divide in the church.
Indeed.

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mackay11
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Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by mackay11 » 13 Oct 2013, 04:10

Life_Journey_of_Matt wrote:Wow, it took me an hour to get to the end of this thread, but I did it.

I would just like to add one thing:
3) We don’t have all the answers.
What would be more meaningful to me is an admission that the answers we think we DO have may not all be right. IMO these are two different things.
I'm working on an article/blog that uses scripture and quotes from GAs to teach this principle.

It's a really important message and it's going to take a very long time to land it.

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Haven
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Re: Todd Christofferson addressed crisis of faith issues

Post by Haven » 13 Oct 2013, 18:52

I haven't been able to read all the posts on this thread because of time limitations but the topic is one that I feel strongly about so I'll just add my 2 cents. I love that the church is releasing information that was "hidden" for so long. I hope it will continue. I enjoy history and I believe honesty about the history is a good thing. I'm fine with people making mistakes, I make plenty all the time. What is so emotional for me is that the church spends soooooooo much time teaching about prophets and asking us to follow them. The amount of time we spend on learning how to rely on the arm of flesh is, well, a lot, and it's obviously not that healthy. IMO that's one reason why the church is in this uncomfortable position. For so long the leaders have been put on a pedestal and of course the membership is going to follow and believe that the leaders are next to perfect. Having a healthy balance would have been better IMO. I like that Ray and others on this site seem to have found that healthy balance. A less black and white way of looking at the leaders. I think if the church would focus more on Jesus and less on imperfect men the membership would eventually come to a more healthy belief about prophets and their limitations. I know I would feel much better in church. Although history is very interesting to me I can read about it at home. I attend church to learn about Christ. Et voila. That's all I have to say for now. 8-)

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