Women and Priesthood

Public forum to discuss questions about Mormon history and doctrine.
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hawkgrrrl
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by hawkgrrrl » 03 Feb 2020, 14:49

To put it in a simpler way, I don't need a man to explain to me what it's like to be a woman, and every time they try, they demonstrate their utter failure to comprehend what they are talking about.

Curt Sunshine
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by Curt Sunshine » 03 Feb 2020, 17:54

^^This.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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DarkJedi
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by DarkJedi » 04 Feb 2020, 06:54

hawkgrrrl wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:49
To put it in a simpler way, I don't need a man to explain to me what it's like to be a woman, and every time they try, they demonstrate their utter failure to comprehend what they are talking about.
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Note that I often think they have no idea what they're talking about.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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SamBee
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by SamBee » 08 Feb 2020, 04:17

hawkgrrrl wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:49
To put it in a simpler way, I don't need a man to explain to me what it's like to be a woman, and every time they try, they demonstrate their utter failure to comprehend what they are talking about.
It cuts both ways. I keep on being told what it's like to be a man by women. Not a clue either.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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hawkgrrrl
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by hawkgrrrl » 12 Feb 2020, 12:52

SamBee wrote:
08 Feb 2020, 04:17
hawkgrrrl wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:49
To put it in a simpler way, I don't need a man to explain to me what it's like to be a woman, and every time they try, they demonstrate their utter failure to comprehend what they are talking about.
It cuts both ways. I keep on being told what it's like to be a man by women. Not a clue either.
Fair enough, but in the LDS church 99% of the speakers in GC are men, and men run the women's organization. I'm not aware of any speaking or leadership platform in the church that puts men under women or gives women a microphone and tells them they should opine about the role of men.

grobert93
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by grobert93 » 12 Feb 2020, 15:24

hawkgrrrl wrote:
12 Feb 2020, 12:52
SamBee wrote:
08 Feb 2020, 04:17
hawkgrrrl wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:49
To put it in a simpler way, I don't need a man to explain to me what it's like to be a woman, and every time they try, they demonstrate their utter failure to comprehend what they are talking about.
It cuts both ways. I keep on being told what it's like to be a man by women. Not a clue either.
Fair enough, but in the LDS church 99% of the speakers in GC are men, and men run the women's organization. I'm not aware of any speaking or leadership platform in the church that puts men under women or gives women a microphone and tells them they should opine about the role of men.
And when a woman is allowed to speak on the microphone, they need the approval of a priesthood leader to validate what they say.

Curt Sunshine
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by Curt Sunshine » 12 Feb 2020, 17:35

And when a woman is allowed to speak on the microphone, they need the approval of a priesthood leader to validate what they say.


To be fair, that is true of when men speak, as well.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

Gerlinde

Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by Gerlinde » 26 Sep 2020, 13:22

I look at the subject from a historical and theological point of view.
In the early church, which never existed as we understand Church today, women, as well as men, had leadership functions. They were deaconesses, leaders of a house churches, even apostles. Women's offices existed until the 6th century, when the office of deaconess disappeared, and only men were allowed to become deacons.
If it was so in the early church, why is it impossible today?

Roy
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by Roy » 27 Sep 2020, 10:17

Gerlinde wrote:
26 Sep 2020, 13:22
If it was so in the early church, why is it impossible today?
I also feel that in the temple ordinances and the blessing ordinances for expectant mothers that there were forms of priesthood practiced by women in the early days of the LDS church.
I personally feel that Lucy Mack Smith saw herself as the church matriarch and in her later years would give "blessings" to her visitors.

Some of the things that we currently reserve for the priesthood actually do not require any priesthood at all (passing the sacrament and collecting fast offerings).

I do see some small changes in this area. I think this is to prepare the way for a future day when women might receive priesthood ordination more fully. Then church leaders can point back to the deaconesses of the early Christian church, to the temple ordinances, blessings for pregnant women, and Lucy Mack Smith's Matriarchal blessings of the early LDS church, and more current things like the GC talk of DHO or the work of Barbara Morgan Gardner - Leaders will be able to point back at all those things as hints or breadcrumbs foretelling to that future day when men and women would be called to more fully work side by side in the cause of our HF.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

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JamesFromMI
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Re: Women and Priesthood

Post by JamesFromMI » 07 Oct 2020, 12:59

For what it's worth, the Church of Jesus Christ (Bickertonite) Church has Deaconesses. Their roles include making sure the meeting house is in order, lead music and have other roles. I believe they have had Deaconesses way longer than the RLDS/Community of Christ and other groups.

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