More temple ordinance changes

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Holy Cow
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More temple ordinance changes

Post by Holy Cow » 20 Jul 2020, 19:01

Sounds like there are some more temple ordinance changes coming soon. Any guesses? I have a few hopes: no more separating men from women during endowment, no more 'tokens,' maybe some updates to the endowment clothing... It's been so many years since I've actually been, I don't really have a vested interest, but will still be curious to hear about the changes.
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nibbler
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by nibbler » 20 Jul 2020, 19:56

It's probably all aimed at getting temples open asap in a post coronavirus world.

I could see husbands sitting with wives because people from the same home could sit next to each other while people from different homes would have to keep an seat or two between them.

I could also see demonstrations or descriptions of tokens without exchanging them.

Maybe something to further shorten sessions to minimize the time people are in enclosed spaces, but that might not make much of a difference. If they shaved an entire hour off the session it would still be a long time in an enclosed space.

And an additional question. If the changes are related to the virus, would things change back once the virus is more under control?
To get the full value of joy you must have someone to divide it with.
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DarkJedi
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by DarkJedi » 21 Jul 2020, 05:12

nibbler wrote:
20 Jul 2020, 19:56
And an additional question. If the changes are related to the virus, would things change back once the virus is more under control?
I wondered about that, too. I would hope not.

My guesses ("speculation") are similar. No actual contact, except I'm not really sure how that will work at the veil. I don't think spouses will sit next to each other but I expect spacing - but that's not an actual change to the ceremony itself.

I've been hoping for several years that the whole thing when done for the dead could be shortened. Perhaps eliminate the whole story part and just do the essentials like the signs and tokens. That would shorten it quite a bit, and perhaps it could be choice between full or brief. I recognize that part (most?) of the reason we go multiple times is to remind ourselves and get fuller understanding but there's also a limit to how much you can learn/understand with the same thing repeated in some cases hundreds of times.

In the end I'll probably learn online what the changes are. I haven't been to the temple in over two years and other than an upcoming wedding I have no plans (and I'm in no rush) to go back.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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Minyan Man
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by Minyan Man » 21 Jul 2020, 05:57

Will we have to wear masks & rubber gloves?

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DarkJedi
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by DarkJedi » 21 Jul 2020, 07:27

Minyan Man wrote:
21 Jul 2020, 05:57
Will we have to wear masks & rubber gloves?
Of the ones in phase 1 (live husband/wife sealings only) my understanding is masks are required. Gloves are not. I think gloves open a different can of worms, and that's why I think the recent changes are likely no contact and as Nibbler says more of a demo (in other words, I don't think there's currently going to be a "we desire all to receive it" component).
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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Minyan Man
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by Minyan Man » 21 Jul 2020, 07:45

Tokens given by elbow bump?

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DarkJedi
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by DarkJedi » 21 Jul 2020, 09:04

Minyan Man wrote:
21 Jul 2020, 07:45
Tokens given by elbow bump?
:lol:
Maybe. Maybe that's the change! I don't know how that will work at the veil though.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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Roy
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by Roy » 21 Jul 2020, 09:14

I did read about some changes to the temple headwear. Reportedly the plastic insert is gone from the men's hats and the tie string that attaches the hat to the robe is no more. Women's veils are now simpler. I personally am glad that we are in an era of changes. If some things that were supposed to be permanent can change then maybe there can be room for additional changes.
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DarkJedi
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by DarkJedi » 21 Jul 2020, 11:16

Roy wrote:
21 Jul 2020, 09:14
I did read about some changes to the temple headwear. Reportedly the plastic insert is gone from the men's hats and the tie string that attaches the hat to the robe is no more. Women's veils are now simpler. I personally am glad that we are in an era of changes. If some things that were supposed to be permanent can change then maybe there can be room for additional changes.
I think that stuff came with the last change, maybe January? It also seems that because temple clothing people converted to mask makers for COVID, the roll out of the simpler clothing was delayed.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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nibbler
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Re: More temple ordinance changes

Post by nibbler » 21 Jul 2020, 16:44

Here's the official statement:

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.or ... -july-2020

One standout:
The sacred teachings, promises, and ceremonies of the temple are of ancient origin, and point God’s children to Him as they make further covenants and learn more about His plan, including the role of the Savior Jesus Christ.
It's odd that an ancient origin was mentioned. You'd just about have to go out of your way to include such phrasing, so it starts to feel like a passive aggressive jab. Consider the same statement with a simple revision:
The sacred teachings, promises, and ceremonies of the temple point God’s children to Him as they make further covenants and learn more about His plan, including the role of the Savior Jesus Christ.
The only difference is I took out "are of ancient origin, and."
To get the full value of joy you must have someone to divide it with.
― Mark Twain

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