Are we the church of the WoW?

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felixfabulous
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by felixfabulous » 23 Jul 2019, 13:14

I just pulled this quote from their website and really like it:

"The Seventh-day Adventist Church recognizes the autonomy of each individual and his or her God-given power of choice. Rather than mandating standards of behavior, Adventists call upon one another to live as positive examples of God’s love and care. Part of that example includes taking care of our health—we believe God calls us to care for our bodies, treating them with the respect a divine creation deserves. Gluttony and excess, even of something good, can be detrimental to our health."

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SamBee
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by SamBee » 27 Jul 2019, 04:05

My ward isn't. We have members who smoke, including one guy who helps with the sacrament. We occasionally get people who come in smelling of drink too.

The WoW is one of the best life choices I've made. If I ever go inactive again, or leave I will still try to keep it
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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Rumin8
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by Rumin8 » 15 Aug 2019, 09:58

"The Seventh-day Adventist Church recognizes the autonomy of each individual and his or her God-given power of choice. Rather than mandating standards of behavior, Adventists call upon one another to live as positive examples of God’s love and care. Part of that example includes taking care of our health—we believe God calls us to care for our bodies, treating them with the respect a divine creation deserves. Gluttony and excess, even of something good, can be detrimental to our health."
Felix, this is great. Thank you for sharing. It is what I have tried to do for the past few years. Not coincidentally I'm more active physically, and in better health than I have ever been.
The WoW is one of the best life choices I've made. If I ever go inactive again, or leave I will still try to keep it
Sam, this is awesome also. I think my whole point with this WoW thread is that we appear (in my experience) to make it a bigger deal than it needs to be. I really resonate with the idea of this being a true "choice" of nutrition and lifestyle. Your choice to continue to obey completely this practice is valid and enhances your life. My journey is different, and that's okay. I have been amused that for inactive or post-mo, some check boxes remain. For example, that if you leave the church you have to start drinking (and liking) coffee and alcohol. If you don't, then you are a bad (post/inactive)-mormon.
"Moderation in all things, especially moderation." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

"Be excellent to each other." - Abraham Lincoln to Bill & Ted

Roy
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by Roy » 15 Aug 2019, 11:18

Recently the church offered some clarification in the "New Era"
Vaping is "clearly against the Word of Wisdom."
Green tea, black tea, and iced tea are all against the WoW.
Medical marijuana is ok by prescription for a specific medical purpose (just like opiods).
Be careful when buying beverages at coffee shops. Either never buy a beverage in a coffee shop or always ask if it has coffee in it.

Honest question. Is it wrong, or a sin, or does it somehow make us unclean to accidentally consume something prohibited in the WoW?
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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nibbler
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by nibbler » 15 Aug 2019, 11:32

Roy,

Do you have a link to the New Era clarification? I found this:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... t?lang=eng

But I didn't see the explicit prohibition on green or iced teas, just counsel to avoid the more general "tea." Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place. The only reason I bring it up is because I've occasionally heard that drinking green tea was okay. I've also heard that it is not okay. People have come up with all sorts of reasons to justify one position or the other.
Roy wrote:
15 Aug 2019, 11:18
Honest question. Is it wrong, or a sin, or does it somehow make us unclean to accidentally consume something prohibited in the WoW?
The linked article says:
What the Word of Wisdom is not
...
An excuse to be obsessive.
“Learn to use moderation and common sense in matters of health and nutrition, and particularly in medication. Avoid being extreme or fanatical or becoming a faddist”1 (a faddist is someone who follows every trend).
FWIW I'd lump concern over accidental consumption as being obsessive.

That said, the WoW was one of those commandments that was similar to tithing, a commandment where I could have pride that I was being 100% obedient (total abstinence). Accidental consumption would have caused concern because it would have broken my spotless record, even if accidental.
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
— Henry David Thoreau

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nibbler
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by nibbler » 15 Aug 2019, 11:35

I found the article with the specifics:

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... a?lang=eng
Green Tea, Iced Tea

Green tea and black tea are both made from the leaves of the exact same tea plant. The only difference is that the leaves in black tea are fermented and in green tea they’re not. They’re both tea and against the Word of Wisdom. Some drinks have tea in them but don’t advertise that fact, so always check the ingredients. Also, iced tea is still tea.
One could use similar logic to ban grape juice. Grape juice and wine are from fruit of the exact same plant. The only difference is that the grapes in wine are fermented and in grape juice they are not!
Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after.
— Henry David Thoreau

Minyan Man
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by Minyan Man » 15 Aug 2019, 12:17

Roy wrote:
15 Aug 2019, 11:18
Be careful when buying beverages at coffee shops. Either never buy a beverage in a coffee shop or always ask if it has coffee in it.
What if the coffee shop is called: "Holy Grounds"?

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felixfabulous
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by felixfabulous » 15 Aug 2019, 14:47

I really don't like this move, I feel like it took what were a few gray areas with tea and coffee and made the most conservative stance the new rule. I think this is going to cause some cognitive dissonance with people (younger people) who see tea as a health drink and can't help see the hypocrisy of saying soda and energy drinks are OK but that tea and coffee in any form is against the health law. I think Jana Reiss also makes a good point in this article https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2019/08 ... emo-young/ that we use health arguments against vaping and then totally try to ignore them with green tea.

Roy
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by Roy » 15 Aug 2019, 15:38

"The [WoW] was created for man, not man for the [Wow]."
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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Heber13
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Re: Are we the church of the WoW?

Post by Heber13 » 15 Aug 2019, 19:02

If drinking coffee is a sin, I believe God knows there are worse sins to be worried about. We aren't expected to be perfect now, and we deceive ourselves if we think all sins are equal.

Wasn't it also a sin to pick corn on the Sabbath, but Christ saw the higher law and could choose wisely?

Isn't that what God wants of us? Doesn't he want us to learn how we choose our position on these topics and how it impacts our heart and how we love God, ourselves, and others?

Seems to me we can draw strength from the WoW, or...we can find something else that helps us draw closer to God and not worry about beans and leaves.

I don't have a testimony of the Word of Wisdom. I feel promises were hyped up for dramatic effect..."windows of heaven opened" type promises...and I never found that to be more than hyperbole. It simply doesn't hold up.

I feel I have more important things in my life to work on. Call me a sinner. Aren't we all?
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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