Name of The Church - Version 152

Public forum for topics that don't fit into the other categories.
User avatar
DarkJedi
Posts: 6019
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by DarkJedi » 24 Sep 2018, 11:42

SamBee wrote:
24 Sep 2018, 11:29
bdavis3 wrote:
23 Sep 2018, 09:52
I see it two ways. The social scientist half of me thinks there is no way that church leaders can prevent people from shortening the name of the church when it's so freaking long. The name "Mormons" has stuck for decades, and it is unlikely that will change.

BUT

If this name change is part of an effort to turn our focus more toward the Savior, I am all for it. I have been searching everywhere for Christ and I ironically rarely find Him or feel Him at church. I'm hoping this is a first step toward turning our sights away from arbitrary teachings and focusing more on what the Savior actually taught, and truly striving to be more like Him.
You need to come to our ward. I think we are fairly good at keeping things Christ-centered just now.
Mine, too. I hoping this is a trend everywhere. I can't say it's every talk every week or every testimony but I can say it's better than it was even five years ago.

And as a stake I think there has been some emphasis on being more Christ centered. Our SC is coming up and in a recent stake council we were asked for talk topic suggestions. After a few suggestions were offered the SP read the area "goals" (they used different semantics) which are not quite published yet, but number 1 of 3 was increasing/deepening conversion to Jesus Christ. The suggestions took a turn for the better from that point and it became pretty clear that the preparedness suggestion (as in prepper) was probably not going to make the cut. I'm happy about that.

So, I agree with BDavis3 - I don't think we're going to change the public any time soon (and maybe this is a little taste of the church leaderships' own medicine as far as change goes) but if this is meant to focus the membership more on Jesus Christ I'm all on board.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

User avatar
Heber13
Posts: 6967
Joined: 22 Apr 2009, 16:37
Location: In the Middle

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by Heber13 » 24 Sep 2018, 15:38

I do think the emphasis on the church name was geared for this purpose...internally to the members as well as others...to emphasize Christ in our church.

I'm not sure it was delivered the best way to emphasize that...but I think it was at the heart of the prophet's thoughts. That's what I felt, anyway.
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

User avatar
SamBee
Posts: 5000
Joined: 14 Mar 2010, 04:55

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by SamBee » 25 Sep 2018, 11:55

Our F&T meetings are always introduced with the idea that we must focus on the Savior. When I have given a talk, I've been instructed to do this too.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

User avatar
Heber13
Posts: 6967
Joined: 22 Apr 2009, 16:37
Location: In the Middle

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by Heber13 » 26 Sep 2018, 09:45

SamBee wrote:
25 Sep 2018, 11:55
Our F&T meetings are always introduced with the idea that we must focus on the Savior. When I have given a talk, I've been instructed to do this too.
Which is how it should be. It's good to hear that.

Most of the things said over the pulpit and through the church newsroom are geared inwardly to members...since that is usually the only people on the planet really paying attention to mormons...dang...I mean...members of the Church. :think:
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

User avatar
DarkJedi
Posts: 6019
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by DarkJedi » 26 Sep 2018, 16:04

Heber13 wrote:
26 Sep 2018, 09:45
SamBee wrote:
25 Sep 2018, 11:55
Our F&T meetings are always introduced with the idea that we must focus on the Savior. When I have given a talk, I've been instructed to do this too.
Which is how it should be. It's good to hear that.

Most of the things said over the pulpit and through the church newsroom are geared inwardly to members...since that is usually the only people on the planet really paying attention to mormons...dang...I mean...members of the Church. :think:
I wish it were so in my ward. As I said previously my ward is not horrible and has improved but we're still not all the way there and we do not have an announcement like that or counsel given when asked t speak. It might be even better were such announcements made.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

User avatar
nibbler
Posts: 3726
Joined: 14 Nov 2013, 07:34
Location: Ten miles west of the exact centre of the universe

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by nibbler » 02 Oct 2018, 09:39

I thought about posting this in the rumor thread but I'll post it here.

In my ward, the Sunday after the announcement we dedicated a large portion of PH to discussing Nelson's desire to use the proper name of the church. Mormons gonna Morm and all but a part of that discussion was letting the group know that as members we shouldn't be saying Mormon anymore, we should follow the counsel of a prophet of god.

I was kinda bummed. One more thing for people to police each other over while at church. I felt it missed what I had hoped was the spirit of the counsel, a call to reorient the church towards Christ.

I now find myself wondering whether policing others, getting onto them and insisting they use the correct name of the church, helps move the needle closer towards that ultimate goal. Maybe it does? If we police people towards saying Christ more we may miss the mark entirely but as a culture would the end result be moving us closer to getting people to focus more on Christ?

Personally I don't think focusing on the name does much to achieve that goal. Maybe if we policed people to say "obey the commandments" instead of "obey the prophet" and to say "follow Christ" instead of "follow the prophet."

But this is all me speculating on what someone else hoped to achieve in the name change. Maybe they had some other goal in mind, or maybe there was no long term goal, maybe it was just a nit stated out loud.

My only point, the policing is annoying, it feels like it misses the mark, but could it have the desired effect long term? After all, the police are going to police regardless, they might as well be policing towards something that's constructive long term.
You can't break what's broken already.
- LeAnn Rimes

User avatar
dande48
Posts: 1066
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by dande48 » 02 Oct 2018, 09:59

nibbler wrote:
02 Oct 2018, 09:39
My only point, the policing is annoying, it feels like it misses the mark, but could it have the desired effect long term? After all, the police are going to police regardless, they might as well be policing towards something that's constructive long term.
Just had a thought: Do you think it might be in attempt to distance ourselves from the spotty history of the Church? Kind of like how the RLDS Church changed their name to "Community of Christ", and practically no one calls them Mormon or associates them with the Mormon Church anymore?

Just last night, in response to another thread, I found this "scholastic" article on the Church's website, called "Joseph Smith's Teachings about Priesthood, Temple, Women" Twice, they referred to members as Mormons. 23 times they referred to us as "Latter-Day Saints". And twice, at the beginning, did they use the full title of the Church.

It was interesting to me, that the full name of the Church was emphasized when relating to us today. "Latter-Day Saints" referred to both past and present, and "Mormon" referring to the early Church members. Maybe I'm reading a little too much into it, but it feels like the modern Church is attempting to identify less with Church history. "That was then, this is now".
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

User avatar
SamBee
Posts: 5000
Joined: 14 Mar 2010, 04:55

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by SamBee » 02 Oct 2018, 13:40

Or the FLDS.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

User avatar
dande48
Posts: 1066
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by dande48 » 02 Oct 2018, 21:04

SamBee wrote:
02 Oct 2018, 13:40
Or the FLDS.
Which are, more or less, the embodiment of everything in early Church history we wish to reject.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

User avatar
SamBee
Posts: 5000
Joined: 14 Mar 2010, 04:55

Re: Name of The Church - Version 152

Post by SamBee » 03 Oct 2018, 02:45

dande48 wrote:
02 Oct 2018, 21:04
SamBee wrote:
02 Oct 2018, 13:40
Or the FLDS.
Which are, more or less, the embodiment of everything in early Church history we wish to reject.
Very much so. But the media persists in calling them Mormons even though our church is unconnected to them.

Like the Phillip Larkin poem "This be the Verse" says "They fill you with the faults they had/ And add some extra, just for you."
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

Post Reply