It's official, so long Scouts

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DarkJedi
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by DarkJedi » 17 May 2018, 15:04

Curt Sunshine wrote:
17 May 2018, 07:27
MANY young women love the current program and hope the new one is better.

Some young women don't like the current program and hope the new one is better.

What works for me doesn't work for a whole lot of other people.

Such is life.
I think the exact same thing could be said for young men.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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DarkJedi
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by DarkJedi » 23 May 2018, 09:40

So here's something I have been pondering for a bit, and I don't know the answer. I'm sure there will at some point in the next year and a half be some actual direction from the church. Now that there are no Scouts, will there be "boys camp?" There has always been girls camp, and this year girls camp moved away from some of the more outdoorsy skills. Girls camp has always been more spiritually bent than Scout camp, but I think it was also appropriate for girls. While I don't think Scout camp was fitting for every boy (especially the ones who didn't care for Scouts anyway), I also don't think the girls camp template was appropriate for (most) boys.

I recognize this is just speculation at this point, but does anyone have any thoughts about what might happen as a replacement for Scout camp? Or what you might like to happen?
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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SilentDawning
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by SilentDawning » 24 May 2018, 02:02

I would like to see an adaptation of the Scouting program where they keep the badges, ditch the uniforms, ditch the military culture, and make it easier to understand for people who weren't raised in it. I had to go through a whole day of Woodbadge training to figure out the bureaucracy and even then it was better to experience it than sit through all that training. Don't turn it into an extended Sunday school class or priesthood meeting -- create a very fun program that attracts boys while providing many opportunities for leaders to build relationships with the youth. Keep the outdoors part of it as this is very powerful for youth to learn to be tough, to learn basis skills out of necessity, to push themselves. Keep high adventure for the older boys.

I think achieving something that is equivalent to Eagle Scout would be great, but call it something different.

I also think that is Scouts was really working for the church, the church would have been a great ambassador for Scouts internationally, with local/cultural adaptations made along the way. But that sounds like it was not the vision of the the BSA or the church.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

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Willhewonder
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by Willhewonder » 29 Jul 2018, 18:42

As I understand it, the Church started scouts to avoid future fiascos like that of the Willie and Martin companies. When the Boy Scouts came along, it was a good match and efficient. So we adopted BSA. So now that we go our own way, are we still thinking about survival skills, or when we have to go back to Missouri, are we in for more Willie and Martin Company disasters? Just saying.

Curt Sunshine
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by Curt Sunshine » 30 Jul 2018, 06:56

Nope. Totally different worlds.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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DarkJedi
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by DarkJedi » 30 Jul 2018, 07:03

Willhewonder wrote:
29 Jul 2018, 18:42
As I understand it, the Church started scouts to avoid future fiascos like that of the Willie and Martin companies. When the Boy Scouts came along, it was a good match and efficient. So we adopted BSA. So now that we go our own way, are we still thinking about survival skills, or when we have to go back to Missouri, are we in for more Willie and Martin Company disasters? Just saying.
The gathering in Missouri is one of those things that has been swept under the rug the past few years. Nobody at the top talks about it anymore. And that's a good thing because it's ridiculous. The church adopted Scouting at a time when that's what most boys were interested in. Times have changed and most boys aren't as interested in outdoorsy things as they once were. And 100 years ago the vast majority of Mormons lived in Utah. That has also changed, the vast majority of church members now live outside the Corridor, many in places where Scouting makes little to no sense.

My own sons were/are into more outdoorsy kinds of things probably at least in part because I am. They may well have been into Scouting without the church and like all things they were interested in (sports and music) I would have supported that. I do hope that Boy Scouts does not become the pariah that Girl Scouts is (undeservedly).
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

Kcrumb
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by Kcrumb » 15 Aug 2018, 00:13

I’ve lived in the UK for 10 years and the Church over here is not at all associated with the scouts, although their is a scouting association over here.

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Gerald
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by Gerald » 02 Jan 2020, 06:30

I thought I'd bump this post up given that Scouts has officially ended. I also came across this nice analysis on By Common Consent: https://bycommonconsent.com/2019/12/31/ ... ore-111013

My own feelings about the end of scouting are mixed. I enjoyed cub scouts quite a bit as I recall but never really enjoyed "Boy Scouts." Adolescence had kicked in by then and it was a program that didn't really work for me anymore. I have only one son who never participated much either (and I didn't really encourage it though if he'd wanted to be more involved, I'd have supported him). That said, I think Scouting (like so many programs) was a good program for SOME young men. I think most Eagle Scouts can and should be proud of that accomplishment (barring those whose mothers did their project for them). My father-in-law served in Scouting most of his life and took pride in making sure that Eagle projects were worthwhile (which sadly got him a lot of criticism in his ward). Even though I won't miss it, I know there are those who will and I feel bad for them. In some ways, it's a sign of an ever changing Church. While none were as big in scope as Scouting, there are a number of programs that the Church has scrapped over time (Was anyone here a Targeteer?) But even though I never participated actively, I do feel a bit of sorrow for losing all that was good in Scouting...and grateful for getting rid of that which was bad.
So through the dusk of dead, blank-legended And unremunerative years we search to get where life begins, and still we groan because we do not find the living spark where no spark ever was; and thus we die, still searching, like poor old astronomers who totter off to bed and go to sleep, to dream of untriangulated stars.
---Edwin Arlington Robinson---

AmyJ
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Re: It's official, so long Scouts

Post by AmyJ » 02 Jan 2020, 10:20

Hi folks,
Here is what I know based on the Face-to-Face with Elder Gong.

Young Men/Young Women
In the new program, there are items that YW/YM can earn every 2 years with a culminating item.

The church will be funding EFY-esque activities - the plan is for every stake to get selected for participating in the camp every few years (I don't remember whether it was 2 or 4). I gather that EFY is being discontinued as such and/or rolled into this.

There is more of an emphasis on stake level stuff and teenagers being part of the decision-making teams with a stake-level youth committee.

Youth Ages 8-12
Things are murkier here. Activities are still held at the ward/branch level scheduled as desired. It was made clear that some/most activities are still gender segregated (again depending on your unit's decisions in this area) but not all activities automatically are.

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