First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

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SilentDawning
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First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by SilentDawning » 04 Mar 2018, 14:29

Our HPGL let us know in advance we were discussing reactivation of HP group stewardship members. I almost didn't want to go as I probably belong on their list -- how it went.

8 people. 3 active participants Everyone else sat there brain dead or on their phones. The whole time I wanted to share how I visited 90 less active prospective elders and found we had only 1 active when I was HPGL. Stake criticized us for the list not being up to date, which I had to refute. Also wanted to say that it would be much more engaging if we had a thriving project schedule of things the active people were into that we could use to bring the less actives along with us. Same old same old, in my view.

No assignments were made -- just talk....something I've been involved in too many times before.

There was a hilarious part. One of the people not into it - a High Counselor, responded to a comment about guy who doesn't come to church because he has insommnia. High Counselor emerges from his coma and says "If you can get him coming to church that'll cure his insomnia".

The quorum laughed by my gut busting laughter went on longer than it probably should have.

I said nothing this particular class. i think it was a good idea to have a local needs session each month to get the quorum working, although in this case I wasn't into it. The SP also dictated what we talked about -- so there as still that top down, programmatic focus that plagues us. There are times it's good, but for our first one, I think it would have been better to have something that sets a good precedent and really energizes the quorum. I am at the point I hope the HPGL keeps warning us about what the topic will be so I can make other plans.

How did yours go?
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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DarkJedi
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by DarkJedi » 04 Mar 2018, 15:55

Funny you should ask....

A little background: Our HPGL clearly doesn't want the job and is at best semi-active. He shows up to church about half the time, but often leaves after SM. We get about one Sunday a month in HP from him. He also doesn't attend ward council, etc. Pickings are slim in our ward and his assistants are both dimwit Luddites. I can't totally blame them because they clearly also don't have leadership meetings and don't seem to know themselves when the HPGL is going to be there and when he's not. On the other hand, they take little initiative and know almost nothing about the new curriculum. I have evidence of that, but I'll spare you and let it suffice to say Sundays are almost nonfunctional and I am strongly considering just not going to PH because it's a waste of my time (of course sitting in the foyer might also be a waste of my time, but at least I could do my own thing without be distracted or irritated). The good news is that the bishop has also about had it with the guy and I'm pretty sure he has submitted a name, although I'm at a loss as to who.

Today: second month in a row with no council. One of the Luddites "taught" a lesson on service (no discussion, etc.). The bishop did come in partway through and at the end suggested a council topic for next time and to which we all agreed - next time isn't until May because of GC. I'll spare you the Luddite response about why it had to wait until May, but the bishop handled it well.

Our SP, who I can't imagine would give a topic because that's just the way he is, is a believer in the curriculum. We discuss it ad nauseum in HC. He asks how it's going in the wards and in general has been disappointed but patient. I'll have no problem expressing my own displeasure this week in HC. Oh, and our own ward HC "advisor" rarely comes, even though our ward struggles mightily.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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SilentDawning
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by SilentDawning » 04 Mar 2018, 20:54

DarkJedi wrote:
04 Mar 2018, 15:55
Our SP, who I can't imagine would give a topic because that's just the way he is, is a believer in the curriculum. We discuss it ad nauseum in HC. He asks how it's going in the wards and in general has been disappointed but patient. I'll have no problem expressing my own displeasure this week in HC. Oh, and our own ward HC "advisor" rarely comes, even though our ward struggles mightily.
This is simply a visible version of the effectiveness of their quorum leadership meetings. If they can't transact business with the quorum, can you imagine how ineffective they must be as a leadership team in general? and can you imagine how hard it is to get people together for a plannign meeting anyway -- moving it into the 3rd hour block is an operationally effective idea. Now it's time to get it working effectively.

Nonetheless, I hope they don't throw out the 1st Sunday concept -- that they stick with it even though it's not effective. The grind of having to do it will eventually give rise to dissatisfaction, intervention, training, or action.

I will say this -- I really think the emphasis on chasing inactives is part of the reason people aren't more committed. If the Sunday was focused on releasing the passions of quorum members, that would make it so much more interesting to attend and be part of it. The assumption of the meeting is that everyone in attendance is as active as the leaders, which is not the case. Instead, use the time to engage the quorum in experiences that they are interested in, or want to do.

As I said before, I'm hoping for the warning every month from our HPGL.

Strange thing is -- everyone leaves me alone in my ward. I guess I have a reputation now :)
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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mom3
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by mom3 » 04 Mar 2018, 21:23

So far - I have missed everyone of them. I am 3 for 3.

In a weird way I am kind of sad. My RS is pretty chatty. I would love to hear the discussions that happen. Whether I agree or not.

In RS we now circle up the chairs to talk. This isn't going so well. They had a suggestion box. I did suggest we drop the circle thing. We talk better when we aren't face to face. It's kind of strange.

Maybe I will make it in May.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

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SamBee
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by SamBee » 05 Mar 2018, 02:06

mom3 wrote:
04 Mar 2018, 21:23

In RS we now circle up the chairs to talk. This isn't going so well. They had a suggestion box. I did suggest we drop the circle thing. We talk better when we aren't face to face. It's kind of strange.
In Elder's Quorum here, we have had the exact opposite experience. When we have rows of chairs, people just sit at the back and say nothing, while people at the front do everything. It brings a level of equality in for us and participation since no one is at the back.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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SamBee
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by SamBee » 05 Mar 2018, 02:20

First hour - F&T. Pretty good. Not the best I've been to, but not the worst either and fairly enjoyable. One guy went on a bit and talked about his health and a missionary produced a by-the-book testimony in which she cried on demand. But we also had a lovely testimony by an ex-bishop who went inactive for years and I know had been badly treated by the organization. Other testimonies were highly personal and sincere.

Second hour - trained up one of the brothers. He's a good guy, but he's way behind schedule on certain things, and turns up irregularly, so I had to pull him in and ensure that he looked at certain materials. A bit of a box ticking exercise.

Third hour - EQ discussion went well. A lot of investigators and new members there. Some mentioned how impressed they were that our church actually went out and helped people. We are helping a sister move house soon for example. As if on cue, the disabled brother (who gave the long testimony) had to go out, and I was able to help him get up and out the door, and I went out with him to check he was alright. This again proved we're not all "jaw jaw" and do go out of our way to help people. He has a double hernia (among other things) and he had to get up and walk around. I definitely believe our church members do practical things for members which many churches do much more rarely (note I didn't say all) - we have another sister who is in hospital and I have helped clean her house with several other people. Society in general needs more of this.

One of the neighboring wards was shut but few of them turned up.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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nibbler
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by nibbler » 08 Apr 2018, 14:47

SilentDawning wrote:
04 Mar 2018, 14:29
8 people. 3 active participants Everyone else sat there brain dead or on their phones.
I wonder how that dynamic will play out now that there are more people because they combined HPG and EQ. My gut tells me that the more people there are the less active discussion/participation there will be. Sounds odd, right? That's one of the things I feel holds Sunday School back from having a decent discussion. There are so many people that are so spread out that everyone figures that the next guy will answer the questions so most people sit there unengaged in the lesson. I worry that adding more people to these councils will have the same effect. Instead of three active participants out of eight people, you'll see four or five active participants out of 30.
SilentDawning wrote:
04 Mar 2018, 14:29
How did yours go?
I really can't abide our 1st Sunday discussions. So far they have all been on topics that don't interest me. Mostly on improving the ward's key indicators stats. No actual talk of specifics about how to go about doing it, just a reminder that more people should be showing up... so they can join in on the lessons we have about how more people need to show up.

But these discussions really don't seem to be aimed at helping me with the challenges that life throws at me, they all seem to be geared toward helping the organization improve some statistic or other.

Unfortunately it's really inspired me to become a statistic this year. I can't find any motivation to attend PH anymore. None.
And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold
-Jesus

Roy
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by Roy » 08 Apr 2018, 16:34

nibbler wrote:
08 Apr 2018, 14:47
Unfortunately it's really inspired me to become a statistic this year. I can't find any motivation to attend PH anymore. None.
FWIW, I find that not attending certain meetings is part of my strategy to stayLDS.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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Katzpur
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by Katzpur » 08 Apr 2018, 16:45

Roy wrote:
08 Apr 2018, 16:34
nibbler wrote:
08 Apr 2018, 14:47
Unfortunately it's really inspired me to become a statistic this year. I can't find any motivation to attend PH anymore. None.
FWIW, I find that not attending certain meetings is part of my strategy to stayLDS.
Mine, too. I try to make it to Sacrament Meeting, except on the first Sunday of the month. I can't deal with Fast and Testimony Meeting. I went today, though, because I missed two weeks in a row prior to Conference due to being sick. I want to take the Sacrament, and maintain that much activity. I haven't been to Sunday School in years, and I generally try to make it to Relief Society about once a month (the week when the lesson is taught my a really good teacher). I've really tried going to all my meetings and having a good attitude, but Sacrament Meeting only seems to work best for me. I can generally get something worthwhile out of it and not end up having to bite my tongue the way I'd have to in SS and RS.
"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." ~Rudyard Kipling ~

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nibbler
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Re: First Sunday Meeting -- how it went

Post by nibbler » 08 Apr 2018, 16:47

For the record, I find the meetings to be the least appealing aspect of the church. ;)
And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold
-Jesus

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