Ray Degraw wrote:Fwiw, there is an inherent conflict between unconditional LOVE and unconditional LAW. The first is possible; the second is not.
Yes, learning to love unconditionally is a critically important aspect of this discussion, but someone can love someone else unconditionally and still disapprove of their actions - as is evidenced by almost everyone here in this forum when you talk about things that others do that drive you nuts and make you want to leave the Church sometimes. Think about that - at length, if necessary.
The key isn't becoming so open that you lose your own personal beliefs and internal standards - or even that the Church as an organization be totally accepting of all actions. The key, imo, is to understand fully the following:
The LDS Church can't be for all, but it CAN offer a theology that opens the same eternal reward for all - and it does that more so than ANY other theology within Christianity. Its members don't always understand that, but its core theology gives eternal hope and grace to the hopeless and condemned in mortality - specifically because it is both open to radical change in mortal understanding and policy AND leaves all judgment, in the end, truly to a loving Father.let them worship how, where or what they may
I would LOVE to see the Church be more accommodating to gay members, but I also LOVE that the 2nd and 11th Articles of Faith leave the possibility door open for them to be exalted even if they can't be accommodated fully in the Church - now and perhaps ever.
Yes! Yes! Yes!
I believe that there are doctrinal changes the church literally can't make and shouldn't have to. But I do see the possibilities for growth in the middle ground. And I know that perhaps I don't have the best experiential evidence to hope....but I still have the hope that these struggles will forge new capacities for helping people not only deal with pain but become reconcilled to Christ at the same time. And I don't confine that hope to SSA only.
How I personally have longed for a place like Rix describes where judgment just isn't part of the deal with friendship. Could you use another member to your group, Rix? How I have wished that I didn't have to hide my struggles and that I had trusted friends I could lean on? Had my experience been different, I dont' know if I would be battling with the church like I am now. But at the very same time, I do have a testimony of the gospel as it is taught. I do believe the gospel and the church are very different entities. It's not a complete knowledge but it is something that I can't in all good conscience deny even though my pain would have me walk away and never come back. I am learning thru my own recovery process that there is so much more wiggle room inside the gospel of JC than I had previously seen or known! I think that is a tremendous thing and I feel grateful that God has helped me understand a few perspectives that way. Perhaps this is where the church needs to open its focus of teaching. I hope the church can learn how to hold its firm position while extending its spectrum of outreach. I know God is able to do that. I think the church is trying and I honestly believe the church has so much love to offer people with SSA or a whole bunch of other stuff. Sometimes I think it stumbles because it has to defend itself. But the church is run by people.....people who are not completely like Christ yet. And part of the Christian deal is supporting all of us in our weakness and deficits. If the people in the church could just simply drop the judgy thing, wouldn't that be a tremendous improvement all by itself? I also think another tremendous boon would be if we each could forgive the church and the people in it more, especially when we fail or lack some piece of Christlike love.
Swim. I agree with all your last comments. The wives! The children! And the husbands too. We stand invisable in the damage path and everyone is so darn focused on the tornado! We need more Jacobs in the church leadership. We really do.
But maybe those of us with these big crosses to bear need to adjust our thinking too. The church can't be everything and perhaps it is unrealistic to think that a man in a suit will always say the right healing thing for every single person. And for those who aren't familiar with these heart wrenching struggles, perhaps it is unfair to expect that they should have all the empathy that is needed. And maybe it is on us not to interpret every dictate from the pulpit as hurtful. I mean in the end, becoming offended because of anothers weakness is a choice. And it certainly isn't the only choice.
We can figure this out. I believe!!!!!!!