Crumbling testimony

Public forum for topics that don't fit into the other categories.
Curt Sunshine
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Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Curt Sunshine » 01 Jan 2016, 14:15

Send me a PM with the name you want to use.

Got it. Done.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

Roadrunner
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Joined: 25 Sep 2012, 15:17

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Roadrunner » 01 Jan 2016, 16:09

The idea of my kids serving missions causes me some stress. I served a mission and thought it was very difficult but it made me a better person. I learned how to interact with people more effectively, learned a useful 2nd language, made some great friendships, saw parts of the world I'll never see again, saw true poverty and what it does to people - taught me compassion. My mission president was average, didn't love him didn't hate him - he was reserved, not a "warm and fuzzy" but not a dictator either.

I want my kids to know they can choose to serve a mission but that they shouldn't feel pressured. They should know it's difficult and often boring and that they delaying two years of college / job. The $$ amount of losing two years of a teachers salary (for example) is ~$50,000 plus the ~$10,000 cost of a mission. I'm not convinced it's worth it but I respect what it teaches often selfish American teenagers. I despise the manipulation that church leaders sometimes use on missionaries and the manipulation that missionaries sometimes use on those they teach.

I have 3 kids 12-17 and the approach is to be open and candid with them and let them decide. I think my oldest may choose not to serve but she doesn't have the same pressure as boys.

Ann
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Joined: 09 Sep 2012, 02:17

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Ann » 01 Jan 2016, 20:56

amateurparent wrote:
West wrote, " ut hey, you know what, let your testimony crumble. Let it fall and explode and release all the tension trying to hold it together. If a building crumbles, it's better to tear it down and build anew. Sort through the pieces, find the best parts, and build it up newer. A little better. And if you ever find yourself in a situation where someone somewhere is judging one of my dear missionaries who never reached that golden number, or a young man who's almost 26 and ducks his head when someone asks when he's going to put in his papers because they don't know how much he's struggling, please stand up for them. The culture won't change any faster if we don't give our part of it a push."
West, I love that paragraph. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences.
This reminds me of a quote that was very important to me at the beginning of all this. We're in a predicament. We don't have every option and resource available, but we have sufficient, I think.
"We are like sailors who on the open sea must reconstruct their ship but are never able to start afresh from the bottom. Where a beam is taken away a new one must at once be put there, and for this the rest of the ship is used as support. In this way, by using the old beams and driftwood the ship can be shaped entirely anew, but only by gradual reconstruction." Otto Neurath
"Preachers err by trying to talk people into belief; better they reveal the radiance of their own discovery." - Joseph Campbell

"The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes." - Marcel Proust

"Therefore they said unto him, How were thine eyes opened? He answered and said unto them, A man that is called Jesus made clay, and anointed my eyes...." - John 9:10-11

jgaskill
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Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by jgaskill » 02 Jan 2016, 05:38

I am sooooooo sorry you are having a hard time and especially sorry for your sons experience. Let me just say that my son Dustin had planned to go on a mission all his life and we were so proud of him for that. Dustin was born with Cerebral Palsy and walks with crutches and is unable to walk long distances. Well the time came for him to go on a mission and he was told he would not be able to go on his mission !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Needles to say he was devastated to the point of being suicidal . We tried several different angles to get the church to change their mind to no avail. In my opinion he could have served a mission at a temple visitor center explaining the gospel to non members but noooooo they wouldn't go for that !!! This is where my faith began to crumble as Dustin was a very innocent hard working faithful member . He is still a member but not nearly as active as he once was . I went on trying to be active in the church and just put it on my shelf but this past year my shelf finally broke and crashed with a loud thud !!!! If I had my way I would be out of the church but I have a TBM spouse who will divorce me if I leave the church at least that is what she says . My point is it is ok to talk about it and continue to be a member even if not a totally comitted member . I have found that talking with others who have or are having a faith crisis really does help. Please don't be a stranger here keep us updated. God Bless you and your son.

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Always Thinking
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Joined: 29 Dec 2015, 11:46

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Always Thinking » 02 Jan 2016, 07:24

@ jgaskill it was actually my husband that went through all of that, sorry if it was confusing the way I posted it. I appreciate your input though and everyone else as well. I'm so sorry to hear about your son being refused a mission. That is just awful. Poor guy :(

Minyan Man
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Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 13:40

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Minyan Man » 02 Jan 2016, 08:59

jgaskill wrote:I am sooooooo sorry you are having a hard time and especially sorry for your sons experience. Let me just say that my son Dustin haad planned to go on a mission all his life and we were so proud of him for that. Dustin was born with Cerebral Palsy and walks with crutches and is unable to walk long distances. Well the time came for him to go on a mission and he was told he would not be able to go on his mission !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Needles to say he was devastated to the point of being suicidal . We tried several different angles to get the church to change their mind to no avail. In my opinion he could have served a mission at a temple visitor center explaining the gospel to non members but noooooo they wouldn't go for that !!! This is where my faith began to crumble as Dustin was a very innocent hard working faithful member . He is still a member but not nearly as active as he once was ...
There are times when the church does try. Then, I hear a story like Dustin.
For example, I just ran across this on lds.org: https://www.lds.org/callings/disability ... t?lang=eng
There are other times when I'll read in the church news a story about someone who goes on a mission in a wheelchair & it's celebrated.

amateurparent
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Joined: 19 Jan 2014, 20:43

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by amateurparent » 02 Jan 2016, 09:10

We know a guy who the church refused to send on a mission because he was fat. He was told to lose weight .. Or no mission for him.

It seemed like an odd reason to refuse an elder, but weight is at least something that a person has some control over. Other challenges in life just are. It makes me sad to hear of someone denied a mission due to physical disabilities.
I have no advance degrees in parenting. No national credentials. I am an amateur parent. I read, study, and learn all I can to be the best parent possible. Every time I think I have reached expert status with one child for one stage in their life, something changes and I am back to amateur status again. Now when I really mess up, I just apologize to my child, and explain that I am indeed an amateur .. I'm still learning how to do this right.

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LookingHard
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Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by LookingHard » 02 Jan 2016, 10:21

I also had a relative that was going to be a college football player until an injury out and end to that. But when he turned in his papers he was told to shed quite a few pounds. He was very physically fit. He did it buy stopping exercise and starved himself. I wonder how big Polynesians are allowed to go?


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Curt Sunshine
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Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Curt Sunshine » 02 Jan 2016, 12:07

There have been serious issues in the past with extremely overweight missionaries, especially when serving in some areas of the world or in areas that require using a bicycle. I saw one such example on my own mission, where an obviously overweight missionary constantly had health issues that derailed the work in every area where he served.

As with other things, I understand the need for limitations, but, as with so many things, it ends up being leadership roulette in many cases - both with strict adherence to the general rule and lack of understanding of general health issues relative to body type and weight. There have been missionaries who have been told to lose weight, for example, who were in much better shape overall than other missionaries who didn't look out of shape by our modern, American standards.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

Minyan Man
Posts: 1720
Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 13:40

Re: Crumbling testimony

Post by Minyan Man » 02 Jan 2016, 12:17

It is interesting that in the private sector, we can not discriminate on the basis of physical disabilities (usually).
By usually I mean firefighters, police, etc have to meet specific physical requirements for the job.

Yet the church can't make accommodations for a disability?
Or maybe they do & we don't hear about it.

I'm off topic again. sorry.

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