Pioneer Trek is stupid

Public forum for topics that don't fit into the other categories.
rebeccad
Posts: 290
Joined: 10 Jul 2012, 10:36

Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by rebeccad » 17 Jul 2013, 01:50

So about a month ago, our bishop was "inspired" to call DH & I as Pa and Ma on trek. By text message. :roll:
DH said he couldn't go, but I said I would go as a single 'Ma'. The bishop (understandably) said he didn't know about that, but would get back to me. Nothing.
Now, with trek 3 weeks away we get an email with instructions for Ma's and Pa's.

Among the things that make me want to blow my top:

The Ma's and Pa's are instructed to search all the belongings of all the youth, including looking inside their sleeping bags and the pockets of their clothing for *anything* not on the packing list.
Among the activities are rifle shooting and hatchet throwing, they didn't tell the parents about these, and have no information regarding conditions or certifications of the instructors.
In the section on sickness is three paragraphs explaining how most problems are just in the youth's heads and you should "be guided by the spirit" but probably should ignore them. It states that major medical issues are unlikely. (This explains why in the previous 2 events several youth were sent home with heat stroke)
Also it states that most of the time illness is caused by drinking too much water, and they are to be limited to 1/2 a cup at each water break.
I knew about the men leaving, but I didn't know that they didn't leave they just walk alongside not helping. This portion is arranged to be up a steep hill and is to be done in complete silence. No one is allowed to speak at all.
"The very same people who are good sometimes are the very same people who are bad sometimes, it's funny but it's true" -Fred Rogers

User avatar
On Own Now
Posts: 1736
Joined: 18 Jan 2012, 12:45

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by On Own Now » 17 Jul 2013, 05:14

Then don't go.

rebeccad
Posts: 290
Joined: 10 Jul 2012, 10:36

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by rebeccad » 17 Jul 2013, 05:40

Well, that is the obvious solution. But my daughter is very excited to go, and won't be talked out of it.

My concern isn't so much about my going, but that the youth are going to be subjected to this level of irresponsibility, and that parents who don't have this information have placed an undeserved trust in leaders to take care of and respect their children.
"The very same people who are good sometimes are the very same people who are bad sometimes, it's funny but it's true" -Fred Rogers

User avatar
Forgotten_Charity
Posts: 779
Joined: 11 Jul 2012, 18:33

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by Forgotten_Charity » 17 Jul 2013, 07:35

Hi Rebeccad. While I share your concern with all issues I find the first 2 to be highly subjective.
The last 2 however are not and are of sever negligence. My family members who are RN and doctors have a huge problem with bad info and practices like that in any place they see it. Having said that I would do what they would do in this situation. Bring it up, if they don't change the last 2 then try to hand over those instructions to a doctor and or therapist to remove or restructure those instructions. Have them write a letter, I know most doctors would have a huge problem with the last 2 and should have no problem getting a letter from a doctor for it.
Having said that, be polite but very firm on those issues if you want. That's what I would do as well as my family members who are TBMs who are RN and doctors. I seem them do it many times, they can't stand false info and bad practices like that being spread. It's too hurtful to the mission and oath to help people with good practices.
But remember to be polite but firm is my sucked toon along with a medical and or therapist letter if you can. Have them read those instructions. I wouldn't want those to become bad practices that result in negligence from false teachings.

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16728
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by Curt Sunshine » 17 Jul 2013, 08:42

My daughters love trek. They made great friendships as a result of it, so I would fight the tendency to dismiss or reject it automatically.

Having said that, treks vary from area to area, and, as FC said, the last two things are not things I would accept silently. I would say, calmly but firmly, that I could not enforce the water ration, for example, in good conscience - and I would use the example of the previous heat strokes and say I simply couldn't be part of a situation that has a high likelihood of ending that way for one or more youth. Literally, I would tell them that I had agreed to go not realizing that the youth would be put in medical danger and could not go if the last two things were not changed.

As for the restrictions on what the youth can bring, I actually don't mind that at all. For example, on something like this, a cell phone really is inappropriate.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

rebeccad
Posts: 290
Joined: 10 Jul 2012, 10:36

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by rebeccad » 17 Jul 2013, 10:50

I don't mind restrictions on what the youth bring. I mind a random leader (most likely a stranger) being assigned to search their belongings for them, including looking in pockets etc.

They literally justify the small water rations by saying their thirst will bring them closer to God and each other.
"The very same people who are good sometimes are the very same people who are bad sometimes, it's funny but it's true" -Fred Rogers

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16728
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by Curt Sunshine » 17 Jul 2013, 11:12

Fwiw, I would not support any random leader searching. At the least, I only would support a leader of the same sex - for, I think, obvious reasons.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
ihhi
Posts: 107
Joined: 14 Nov 2012, 20:34

Post by ihhi » 17 Jul 2013, 11:24

While I loved trek as a youth, I have a difficult time with it as a sentient adult. I have a hard time reconciling my 'spiritual' experiences from trek as more than just experiences where I was either manipulated (water rations for humility?) into feeling the spirit, or where group activities were used to help us feel the spirit. I think sometimes we can feel powerful emotions being involved in something big like this, but often it isn't the spirit. I have felt similar emotions at the start of a mountain bike race, singing the national anthem and as we shared our experiences around the camp fire on college backpacking trips.

For these reasons, among others I have a difficult time with these Mormon role playing camps. Our ward is doing Moroni's Quest this summer and I feel relieved that I am no longer in young men's for this. Before I quit my calling I was worried that I wouldn't be able to match the kids enthusiasm for this event, as sometimes I tend to get my grumpy, jaded side get the best of me.

Sent from my GT-I9100M using Tapatalk 4 Beta

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16728
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by Curt Sunshine » 17 Jul 2013, 13:35

I've never heard of Moroni's Quest. What is it?
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
mom3
Posts: 4048
Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 14:11

Re: Pioneer Trek is stupid

Post by mom3 » 17 Jul 2013, 13:52

I have plus and minus feelings about trek's. One thing that was important to me as a parent was to teach my daughter that the re enactment was not a complete picture of the entire exodus west. The first 2 or 3 companies made it with little problem. Or at least not in the sense that the Willey handcart people faced. I wanted her to know that. I felt it was important to explain to her that the members of the earlier companies who made it with less trauma were just as valiant and dedicated to the church as the hand cart members.

The lack of acknowledgement of this fact probably annoys me most. If every trek was varied, if a fuller account was given or enacted, I think we would be using the experience wiser. Good luck to you and your heart as you go. Take God and prayer with you, He knows the trek and it's history better than anybody.

FWIW - I don't believe President Hinckley envisioned a torture experience when he endorsed the hand cart trek ideas. He took the idea from the sesquicentennial trekkers. Their experience was a happy re enactment, much like present Civil War re enactments. I know a few families that were part of that. Everyone ate well, had great square dances, sweet campfires, and soul full reflection. I believe President Hinckley was encouraging more of that, not intense deprivation.

Last of all, good for you for going. Maybe you can find happy journal entries, and positive pioneer stories to tell. Again, good luck.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

Post Reply