Cafeteria Mormonism

Public forum for topics that don't fit into the other categories.
Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 15381
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by Curt Sunshine » 17 Jul 2017, 15:36

I do know for sure, since I know a couple of people involved in the humanitarian efforts. That figure was the cash donations. It didn't include the vast majority of what has been given.

Having said that, nibbled is correct. Publicizing anything will generate apologetics and criticism, no matter what the numbers are.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
mom3
Posts: 3140
Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 14:11

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by mom3 » 17 Jul 2017, 16:24

The challenge whether to disclose or not gets even messier because a bunch of people get to influence that decision. I am watching it happen from the sidelines in my local area. The top leadership made no request for it. But regional people want it. Only time will tell.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

User avatar
nibbler
Posts: 3201
Joined: 14 Nov 2013, 07:34
Location: Ten miles west of the exact centre of the universe

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by nibbler » 17 Jul 2017, 16:34

I know this is wrong but I could really go for a salisbury steak right now.
Let me out, what you see is not the same person as me, my life's a lie, I'm not who you're looking at, let me out, set me free, I'm really old, this isn't me, my real body's slowing dying in a vat.
Is anybody listening, can anyone understand, stop looking at me like that and actually help me, help me, help me I'm gonna die.
― Tiny Rick

User avatar
LookingHard
Posts: 2613
Joined: 20 Oct 2014, 12:11

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by LookingHard » 17 Jul 2017, 17:36

nibbler wrote:
17 Jul 2017, 16:34
I know this is wrong but I could really go for a salisbury steak right now.
Do you want gravy on that sir?

User avatar
ConfusedMolly
Posts: 29
Joined: 13 Jun 2014, 12:22

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by ConfusedMolly » 17 Jul 2017, 18:41

My "cafeteria Mormonism" is definitely tied to the things I have lost a testimony of or that I'm struggling to regain a testimony of... One of those things being how literal "prophecy" is from our modern prophets. I believe that God speaks through them, but I do not believe that everything they speak is from God.

-I don't think Heavenly Father needs me to wear garments. They are soooooo uncomfortable and ugly. I really just can't wear them.

-I don't think 10% tithing is necessary. I do think donating our time and our money is very important, I just don't have a testimony in the hard rule of 10% to the church.

-I don't think 3 hours of church is necessary. Really, that's crazy. We just attend sacrament meeting.

-I think it's fine to spend money on a Sunday. Sunday is a family day for me, so if we want to go out to dinner as a family, we do it.

-I completely disagree with the church's stance on LGBTs.

-I'm not sure how I feel about Joseph Smith

When I look at my list, it really doesn't seem like that big of a deal... but it is a HUGE deal because 3 of those things disqualify me for a temple recommend.

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 15381
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by Curt Sunshine » 17 Jul 2017, 20:11

Molly, fwiw, I see only one of the things on your list that definitely would keep you from the temple, as you worded them: tithing. Frankly, even that can be nuanced, if you are paying 10% of your income / increase (however you honestly define that) to good causes - especially if one of those causes is tithing to the Church, so you are contributing to that category. I know that is a stretch and not what the person asking the question means by it (or how I do it), but it is paying a tithe.

Also, if you pay some amount in tithing to the Church, do so online. It is much easier.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
mom3
Posts: 3140
Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 14:11

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by mom3 » 17 Jul 2017, 22:15

The temple is such a key place for Mormon connection. I have been there. You might want to decide what it is about the temple or the temple recommend that is important to you. There are no wrong answers. Maybe you only want to have one to attend family events like weddings, etc. Maybe you like the quiet and rhythm. That's good too. Maybe it just feels like a thing to hold on to right now. Go for it. Hang on to it. You don't have to renew your recommend for two years.

Perhaps get yours renewed right now while the records still show you as a full tithe payer by the churches exact standard. Tuck it away in your wallet or some special place for when you need/want it. Then work out these details over the next two years. None of us know where we will be emotionally, spiritually, or anything in the next two years. It buys you time. Relieves stress. Keeps you on the up and up until you sort it out. If you have just renewed it, move on to the tucking it away. Throw your questions out to us. We can set you up with links and answers to help you think. The final answer will still be yours.

We have a thread all about the temple questions and answering them. Read through it slowly, carefully. See if anything good pops out to you. I know some pretty jerky people who have recommends, a person with doubts has equal right to the building as they do. Just sayin'.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 15381
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by Curt Sunshine » 18 Jul 2017, 09:12

mom3's advice is good. (It always is. :smile: )
I know some pretty jerky people who have recommends, a person with doubts has equal right to the building as they do. Just sayin'.


Amen - and a-freaking-men. I am and have been a temple worker, and I know personally that a few of the people I see or saw attending the temple regularly are not wonderful people. Fewer are true jerks, but I do know some of them, as well.

The temple recommend threads are excellent - and they contain input from a lot of varying perspectives. I think they might help, so I also encourage you to read them. nibbler compiled all of the links into one thread:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5534&p=75813&hilit= ... ons#p75813

[I just made it a "sticky" topic in the History and Doctrine section.]
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
ConfusedMolly
Posts: 29
Joined: 13 Jun 2014, 12:22

Re: Cafeteria Mormonism

Post by ConfusedMolly » 18 Jul 2017, 14:12

Thank you so much for your insight Mom3 and for that link, Ray! I actually don't have a current temple recommend, but the tithing thing really shouldn't be a problem right now since I am a SAHM and don't have an "income." But, the whole story behind my experience with tithing is kind of long and I don't want to hijack this thread. Maybe I'll finally do my intro post, since I've been posting on and off here since around 2014. :smile:

Post Reply