After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Public forum, tell us about yourself and what brings you to StayLDS!
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Willhewonder
Posts: 66
Joined: 28 Jul 2016, 08:54

After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Willhewonder » 28 May 2017, 12:26

I am approaching a year here, and I have some discovery observations to share, both about the forum, myself and the other residents:

I think the forum provides a needed ministry and is instrumental in the salvation of souls. I think there is a good spirit here and that many people try to help those that bring forth their problems. I am thankful for the moderators and sages that preserve the site, and for the many hours they spend trying to help others. I'm thankful for those that share their stories and I think that many of the people that struggle much do so because they have a high level of integrity and are trying to find a righteous way to reconcile all the different voices we hear in and outside the Church. I admire many of the members, both for their counsel and also for the struggle they endure as they try to understand and to help others understand.

As for myself, I have found the forum to be a means of enlightenment and liberation. People will talk about things and sort through them like I have heard nowhere else. I have been able to see clearly and clarify a number of puzzles left over from my Primary days (and my Bruce R. McConkie Mormon Doctrine first edition days) that have in the past kept me tied up in knots. Here are some discoveries I've made and conclusions I've reached. I understand that the process is ongoing and iterative.

1. I am a nuanced member! I always thought of myself as a TBM, but I see now that it can not be so, and it has not been so. That being said, I don't know that having a faith crises describes me adequately. A better description would be transitioning in faith. Some of my major nuances are in regard to imperfections of Joseph Smith, fallibility of church leaders and appreciation of "leadership roulette", historicity of the scriptures, temple worthiness, literalness of temple and other covenants, testimony, the Atonement, and the difference between the Church and the Gospel.
3. At the same time I admit to being nuanced, I recognize in myself a fierce tribal loyalty to the "Mormon Tribe", whatever that is, come what may. There is much to do in sorting this out. What is the "Mormon Tribe" and what are the ethical limits to being loyal to it?
4. I am not the best person in the world! In fact, compared to many other members of the forum, I feel much less diligently about the particulars of many issues, and easily decide to do whatever I like about them, wrong or right. Yet, I struggle with plenty of issues. Sometimes it is a struggle with ignorance, and sometimes it is a struggle with personal weakness. Sometimes I have thought it is a weakness, but now I think it may be ignorance, thanks to this forum.
5. I want to discuss some of these findings further, but am not sure if this is the board I should post to or if I should post to the discussion board. Since this posting has to do with approaching an anniversary to an introductory post, it may be appropriate here, with postings of the specific example discussions posted on the discussion board. In the absence of better information, that is how I will proceed. Maybe I'll call them "Anniversary Posting: Personal Nuance Take on Testimony" for example, or just "Anniversary Posting: Testimony". See you there.

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Minyan Man
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Joined: 15 Sep 2011, 13:40

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Minyan Man » 29 May 2017, 07:49

Happy Anniversary. I've always thought that the purpose of this site was self discovery.
I am interested in what you have to say & post.

Roy
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Joined: 07 Oct 2010, 14:16
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Roy » 29 May 2017, 09:13

Sounds great Willhewonder. For me half the value of this site comes down to "I am not alone/crazy/deficient to see and think about things the way that I do."
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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Reuben
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Joined: 05 Nov 2016, 10:04

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Reuben » 29 May 2017, 09:18

Roy wrote:
29 May 2017, 09:13
Sounds great Willhewonder. For me half the value of this site comes down to "I am not alone/crazy/deficient to see and think about things the way that I do."
So true. With that in mind, please do post anything related to self-discovery. I can almost guarantee that even if it feels like it's just about you, it's not.
My intro

Love before dogma. Truth before loyalty. Knowledge before certainty.

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SilentDawning
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Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by SilentDawning » 29 May 2017, 10:33

This site provided me with ACCEPTANCE. You don't get it in your home ward from the leaders or stalwarts when you fall of the orthodox wagon. They are too steeped in the culture and tradition. I have always been unbound by convention and tradition -- in the way I dress, in my ideation, in the way I view what is important in life -- and it rubs the wrong way at church.

Here at least you can just blurt out what you think provided it's not anti-Mormon and has a point toward staying in the church. Maybe that's a good guide to helping you decide what to post and what not to post.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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LookingHard
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Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by LookingHard » 29 May 2017, 10:37

SilentDawning wrote:
29 May 2017, 10:33
This site provided me with ACCEPTANCE.
Amen - and I will say again - thanks for all of you on this board that have helped me heal the last few years. This sight has helped me get my feet under myself.

And Will - I don't see any reason to go ahead and share some more.

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Heber13
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Location: In the Middle

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Heber13 » 29 May 2017, 10:49

Thank you truly for taking time to post those thoughts. I think there are many times people come and go from the site...I often wonder if any of this mattered...if any of the topics are relevant today to people. It is great to hear you express how you've used the support forum here. And you shared it all so nicely...I just want to say thank you...your contributions and others like you are what makes this forum of value.
Willhewonder wrote:
28 May 2017, 12:26
I want to discuss some of these findings further, but am not sure if this is the board I should post to or if I should post to the discussion board. Since this posting has to do with approaching an anniversary to an introductory post, it may be appropriate here, with postings of the specific example discussions posted on the discussion board. In the absence of better information, that is how I will proceed. Maybe I'll call them "Anniversary Posting: Personal Nuance Take on Testimony" for example, or just "Anniversary Posting: Testimony". See you there.
I really really really hope you will post these and start these threads. I want to know what you have in mind.

I want to discuss them and pursue differences in thoughts.

I want to push the boundaries of discussion on these forums so our content is more meaningful and with more depth and variation in thought and perspective.

Please...post. Start the conversations that many other readers may be thinking about but not wanting to start it.

I look forward to reading and learning from your experiences, thoughts, and posts. Thanks for being here. Happy Anniversary. :thumbup:
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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Willhewonder
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Joined: 28 Jul 2016, 08:54

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Willhewonder » 29 May 2017, 14:43

Thanks so much for all your encouraging comments. You are very kind. I think maybe I erred somewhat in using the word "discovery". It's not so much that I have discovered the great truths of things as that I have uncovered areas of nuance or divergence from my previous assumptions. So now, what do I put in place of these ideas? I have some ideas, but I'm pretty unsure about many of them and I would very much like some back and forth to help sort them out. When the kids were still at home, I would build elaborate logical structures to determine what decisions should be made about some of their issues. DW would listen to me for awhile and then say,"No, I think we should do this". And she would be right. My heart told me so. Never mind the elaborate logic. Kind of frustrating, but of great benefit to the children. Maybe you folks in the forum can help in like manner on these things. And I think I'll post them to the support board, rather that to the discussion board. Thanks again.

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DarkJedi
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Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by DarkJedi » 29 May 2017, 19:02

Roy wrote:
29 May 2017, 09:13
Sounds great Willhewonder. For me half the value of this site comes down to "I am not alone/crazy/deficient to see and think about things the way that I do."
I just wanted to put a +1 on this one and say post away, Will. I gain much from the discussions we have here.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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Heber13
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Joined: 22 Apr 2009, 16:37
Location: In the Middle

Re: After Almost a Year Here What do I Know?

Post by Heber13 » 30 May 2017, 07:43

Willhewonder wrote:
29 May 2017, 14:43
When the kids were still at home, I would build elaborate logical structures to determine what decisions should be made about some of their issues. DW would listen to me for awhile and then say,"No, I think we should do this".
It is interesting to see different approaches to problem solving and learning and decision making. I dont think one way is better than other ways, but there are benefits to knowing and accepting different styles. At certain times, your logical and deep approach has probably benefitted you in life.

Here is an example of some different Color Styles
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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