God the Ultimate vs God the Father (Demiurge)

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Re: God the Ultimate vs God the Father (Demiurge)

Post by Heber13 » 02 Jun 2018, 14:36

DarkJedi wrote:
02 Jun 2018, 14:30
From The Christ Who Heals p. 47:
Our heavenly parents created us for our glory, not for theirs, and Christ orients his entire divine activity around the grand project of bringing us to where he is.
:thumbup: Like it!

So...would you say, DJ, that worshipping God is for our glory, not theirs? Why is worship needed? Specifically...why is a 3 hour block of church worship needed, or a 2 hour block of temple worship needed?
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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Re: God the Ultimate vs God the Father (Demiurge)

Post by dande48 » 03 Jun 2018, 07:47

Heber13 wrote:
02 Jun 2018, 14:28
But why is point#1 need God to be imperfect? What is the definition of "perfect"? Wasn't Christ perfect, even if He was not at the same progression point as the Father (yet)?
The "Problem of Pain", as C.S. Lewis put it, is this:
“If God were good, He would wish to make His creatures perfectly happy, and if God were almighty He would be able to do what He wished. But the creatures are not happy. Therefore God lacks either goodness, or power, or both.”
There are many ways to address this. The theology behind the Demiurge answers this, basically by saying that the creator is imperfect. C.S. Lewis stated that God's "good" must be different than ours (which IMHO, sort of negates calling him "good in the first place). There's also the "Best of all possible worlds" theory, that became popular around the mid-1600s, saying that all events lead to the most idealistic outcome, even if there's hardship inbetween. But as Voltaire put it, "We must cultivate our garden". And then there's the "Demiurge" theory, which basically states, as you put it, that the Creator is not on the same level as "God the Ultimate".

The trouble is, we're dealing with multiple definitions of "perfect" and "good", or we are wrong in our views of God as being "perfect" and "perfectly good". Probably both.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

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