The 1/3 of the Host of Heaven

Public forum to discuss questions about Mormon history and doctrine.
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DarkJedi
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Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: The 1/3 of the Host of Heaven

Post by DarkJedi » 18 Sep 2017, 18:22

Roy wrote:
25 Nov 2013, 16:20
DarkJedi wrote:
Joni wrote:
I think that God is a lot less compassionate and infinitely loving than what we tell kids in Primary.
Me, too.
I think Paul the Apostle might agree with you too. He talks about how it is God's perogative to create one vessel for honor and another for dishonor. He is the creator, it is His decision. I just disagree with Paul. ;)
My thinking has evolved considerably on this subject. I still don't think what we teach Primary is totally correct, but I have come to believe God is far more merciful and full of grace than most members believe or understand.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

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SamBee
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Re: The 1/3 of the Host of Heaven

Post by SamBee » 19 Sep 2017, 05:28

Here's an odd one. We know dead people can receive proxy baptism - how about demons?!

We know a lot of people are near the edge of damnation, so what if there are demons who narrowly missed salvation? Odd idea and the notion seems to be none of them can find a way back.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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Heber13
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Re: The 1/3 of the Host of Heaven

Post by Heber13 » 19 Sep 2017, 11:18

SamBee wrote:
19 Sep 2017, 05:28
We know a lot of people are near the edge of damnation, so what if there are demons who narrowly missed salvation? Odd idea and the notion seems to be none of them can find a way back.
It seems to make less sense to be a "punishment" that one choice means a soul can never find their way back or have a 2nd estate, or 3rd estate but all is lost by one choice at one time.

It makes more sense that some choose to not want to come follow the Savior as part of God's plan they way it is being taught in some scriptures.

What if the 1/3 hosts of heaven are not wallowing in pity and remorse and so angry they are trying to steal bodies of others? What if they are more like inactive members of the church...they don't have temple recommends to get into the temples...but...they really don't care. They have their own lives/existence and find meaning and purpose in other ways? Members call them "lost" and try to reach out and save them or invite them back...but many are just not interested...not really lost, just not interested in doing it the way church members do it.

Members sometimes assume that following Christ as a member of the mormon church is the ONLY way to find any happiness. Ask the billions of non-church members...many would say they are doing just fine, and are not angry or bitter towards the church and it's members. In fact, most don't really know the church exists...or don't care. And they have their own path to enlightenment and peace and happiness, and doing just fine.

And...it seems that inactive members can always join the church if they want to, or repent and come back, if they want to. They are welcome whenever they choose to. For a church with teachings to make things so fair to everyone (non-infant baptism, proxy ordinance work, raising children in the millennium, degrees of glory based on knowledgeable choices, spirit prison as a temporary state of mind, excommunication but repentance allowed, etc etc etc.) ...why would we believe in a teaching that a war in heaven damned 1/3 of the souls with no 2nd chance?

I view 1/3 of the hosts of heaven similarly to those who aren't interested in the church. Some just don't find a compelling reason to join. It is their choice. That is more likely than some punishment preventing them to from doing something they know they want but can't because the blew it.

Either that ... or ... there really aren't 1/3 of hosts of heaven out there not coming to earth...and it is all a symbolic story to convey some meanings and teachings.

Lots of possibilities. We really don't know how it works. We just use stories to help us choose to be good while alive on this earth.
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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SamBee
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Re: The 1/3 of the Host of Heaven

Post by SamBee » 19 Sep 2017, 17:25

The official line is - they've had it and the lot of them are railing against humanity and are completely blind.

However, thanks to LDS, it seems those who were never born could potentially have a get out card.

Given the choice of horrible eternal punishment or accepting a proxy baptism, some such entities might actually want out of the satanic military after years of conscription!

Now there's a thing we never talk about. However, we'd need to know their names. I can't see this happening, but still. If humans vary in goodness, maybe some demons are less bad, or perhaps they get thrown in some kind of demonic hoosegow for possible traitors!
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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