Old Wounds

Public forum for those seeking support for their experience in the LDS Church.
Roy
Posts: 5640
Joined: 07 Oct 2010, 14:16
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Old Wounds

Post by Roy » 12 Apr 2019, 11:33

Daughter1 wrote:
11 Apr 2019, 15:32
Beach, I wasn't emotionally impacted by the POX or its reversal as many others here. But I do relate to the feeling that you don't belong and there is no one who really understands. In my life, my mom, my dad, and one of my closest friends have all gone through a faith transition. Each one has a different approach to it, a different reaction to it, and a different set of catalysts. Mine is unique as well. And I feel frustration and isolation when I realize that whether I'm talking to someone fully orthodox, someone who has experienced a faith crisis, or someone who isn't a member, I cannot fully express what I am feeling.

I'm learning that it's ok. I'm learning to cherish that my feelings are things only God and Christ will ever comprehend accurately. And that is how I manage to come back. After my realization that I wasn't going to receive the promised witness of the BoM, I felt a bit betrayed. My prayers have become less consistent. But whenever I kneel to pray, I am reminded that God does know how I feel. And He is the only one who does. So I will always return to prayer.

God knows how you feel. I don't, and I'm sorry I cannot empathize fully. But He can. Your pain, both at the inception and reversal of the policy are things He knows.
Thank you for sharing this. We all (as humans) have so much in common that we should be able to see reflections of ourselves in all of of fellow beings. OTOH, our uniqueness (both in being and in experiences) and means that in some ways we are completely alone.

Like you, I do believe that God can feel what I feel. Believing that God likewise does this for all humans everywhere helps me to be more empathetic towards others. IOW the same God that cries for my pain also cries for theirs.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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SilentDawning
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Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: Old Wounds

Post by SilentDawning » 13 Apr 2019, 05:02

Beachplease7 wrote:
07 Apr 2019, 20:36
This weekend has been so hard for me. I feel like the reversal of the policy of exclusion, has opened wounds I was healing. I’m so angry that, just like that, everyone can feel great again because it was reversed. I’m reeling. What of the people who lost their lives? What of the people who lost their church memberships? What of the people who lost their testimonies and had their whole world turned upside down? Why can’t the church take ownership? Why can’t they apologize? My family is believing and active. What used to be such a nice weekend of peace and hope has turned into quite the opposite for me. I’m so emotional and truly don’t know where I belong. I’m surrounded by people but feel more alone than I ever have.
Felt great emotion when Dallin H Oakes, in the PBS special said, regarding the Mountain Meadow Massacre, "there's no doubt members of our church were involved....' and then he apologized and said his heart goes out to the families and hoped they would have comfort. That meant a lot to me, even though he stopped short of indicating a leader of any kind was accountable for what happened. There is no way 100 Mormon men would murder the same number of people without an "inspired order" behind it -- in the name of "obedience".

When they won't apologize or given half apologies meant to save face, or seem to think sorry, as in implied message, is good enough, it always causes me sorrow. Because it shows the kind of arrogance I would think wouldn't exist in the leadership of God's church.

The only source of comfort I have in these things is my current state of living my life with as much happiness as possible. This means carefully considering all policies, and then living them only to the extent they make me happy. It's becoming a norm where the many failings of the church become a kind of justification for the path that I'm on.

The damage done in the past -- yep, that is a concern. Their inability to apologize -- take that the same way you would take a loved one who never apologizes. I have one like that. You just have to accept it.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

Roy
Posts: 5640
Joined: 07 Oct 2010, 14:16
Location: Pacific Northwest

Re: Old Wounds

Post by Roy » 15 Apr 2019, 08:56

SilentDawning wrote:
13 Apr 2019, 05:02
The damage done in the past -- yep, that is a concern. Their inability to apologize -- take that the same way you would take a loved one who never apologizes. I have one like that. You just have to accept it.
Yes, treat them with respect. Do not burn bridges, sever relationships, or cause family feuds. Nor do you need to stay in a position to take abuse. Boundaries are the order of the day.
My MIL is one of these kinds of people. One helpful boundary that we have implemented is to not stayover at her house when visiting. That way we can drop by and eat, play games, and talk but then when things get heated or uncomfortable it is like "Oh my, look at the time! We really need to get going to the next item on our agenda. We'll see you again tomorrow before we go back home. Take care!" :thumbup:
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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SilentDawning
Posts: 7206
Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: Old Wounds

Post by SilentDawning » 15 Apr 2019, 10:43

Roy wrote:
15 Apr 2019, 08:56
Yes, treat them with respect. Do not burn bridges, sever relationships, or cause family feuds. Nor do you need to stay in a position to take abuse. Boundaries are the order of the day.
Right. When it comes to the church, recognize that you are working with an organization that has many merits, but one constraint/weakness/policy/personality trait of the organization as a whole is that it rarely apologizes. Further, its leaders can come across a bit arrogant -- a biproduct of their faith the church is inspired. It's hard not to believe you are right all the time when you've been told ideas come from God Himself.

Non-revaltory reasons include fear of lawsuits, membership loss of those who don't know about the infraction, or who consider the church perfect, etcetera. Whatever the reason, we have a church that doesn't apologize easily. Whether this is an average amount of lack of apology-making or above average is open for analysis and debate, but the fact is, when the church leaders make a mistake, the most you can rely on is Uchdortfs comment that past leaders have made mistakes.

In my experience, some leaders, at the local level, are willing to apologize for the mistakes of leaders in LDS agencies, but that's hollow. You know, like Switzerland apologizing for the failings of another nation. It's hollow because it's easy to apologize when you don't have to eat your own crow.

So, I will not allow myself to get into any kind of transaction where the stakes are so high that an apology would be necessary if they make a mistake. Limit those opportunities. And guess what -- even if we saw a torrent of apologies from the church on various issues, there is no guarantee anyone, the church or individuals, will apologize for any personal wrongdoing that may happen. It's the nature of many situations to be vague about what is an infraction, and what is not -- some people think they've done nothing wrong. Sometimes the wrong person feels there has been a wrong when there hasn't been, or its unintentional. That's on a personal level, but on a church wide policy level (blacks and the priesthood, POX, one year penalty) I know how much it can hurt when they make narrow-minded policies that really hurt lots and lots of people for generations.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

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