Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Public forum for those seeking support for their experience in the LDS Church.
Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16610
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by Curt Sunshine » 22 Dec 2018, 09:10

Heber shared this in another thread. I loved it and thought it was worth its own thread.

Omni 1:2-3 says:
I of myself am a wicked man, and I have not kept the statutes and the commandments of the Lord as I ought to have done.
.... I had kept these plates according to the commandments of my fathers; and I conferred them upon my son Amaron. And I make an end
.

We can question Omni's self-evaluation, but, taking the words for what they actually say, it appears that someone who might not have felt comfortable answering temple recommend questions, for example, still did hisnpart simply by doing his duty as a son and a father and passing on his heritage to his descendants.

If someone like that can be a keeper of the sacred records (a guardian of the Law), we probably don't need to stress too much about our own non-orthodoxy.

Maybe you don't need to be a Nephi. Maybe being an Omni is enough.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
mom3
Posts: 3986
Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 14:11

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by mom3 » 22 Dec 2018, 23:49

That is my favorite book in the BoM. I love the idea of leaders being too busy living to stop and pontificate. Passing it on, really is enough.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

User avatar
SilentDawning
Posts: 7229
Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by SilentDawning » 23 Dec 2018, 08:24

Curt Sunshine wrote:
22 Dec 2018, 09:10
Heber shared this in another thread. I loved it and thought it was worth its own thread.

Omni 1:2-3 says:
I of myself am a wicked man, and I have not kept the statutes and the commandments of the Lord as I ought to have done.
.... I had kept these plates according to the commandments of my fathers; and I conferred them upon my son Amaron. And I make an end
.
Maybe you don't need to be a Nephi. Maybe being an Omni is enough.
Never thought of it that way, but it's definitely my way of thinking. Very insightful thought! I don't dissuade anyone from the church, and don't want to rain on anyone else's parade. Will support my family in their pursuit of LDS living, and have.

I don't consider myself a wicked man though -- although I know I've got my own deficiencies like anyone else.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

User avatar
dande48
Posts: 1443
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by dande48 » 23 Dec 2018, 19:31

Wasn't it Heber, not Nibs, who posted originally that scripture? That's not quite how I read it, but an interesting take. But with respect, I do think you're reading pretty heavily into it, with lots of additional commentary to support your view...

Omni wasn't talking about his lack of faith or belief. He said he hadn't kept the commandments. He was upfront about "not keeping the commandments" too. In Omni's situation, he said that despite not keeping the commandments, he was still going to keep this one, and passed the record on. It had nothing to do with the other commandments he had broken. It had nothing to do with giving nuanced answers to the Bishop to get him to do what you want. It had nothing to do with a lack of belief (which applies to half the recommend). "Worthiness" wasn't a requirement.

... And it never talks about why he chose to do what he did. There weren't many ethical considerations for him to take into account behind his decision. Do you lie to keep social order? Do you maintain the status-quo, with all its faults, because you're afraid the alternative is worse? Do you pass on a heritage, with a complete mixed bag of good and evil... because your parents did, and it's what's expected of you? Can there be integrity, if you are act against your beliefs for some "greater good" (i.e. Bill Reel's recording)?
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16610
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by Curt Sunshine » 24 Dec 2018, 10:28

I will change the citation. Thanks.

I didn't mean to imply a direct, exact situation match. I just meant to highlight that someone who considered himself a "wicked man" (not a "valiant example of righteousness", if you will) did his part in passing on his heritage. That was all.

I think the temple recommend comparison is fine. I know it is not a perfect analogy and has its issues, but I didn't imply lying to go to the temple or even coming up with nuanced interpretations. Based only on his subjective self-description (which doesn't say anything about his beliefs or which specific commandments he wasn't keeping), I am saying Omni might not have been a temple attender in our modern times (and he might have been inactive or semi-active) - but he still kept his people's sacred records and passed them on to his descendants. He might have fit in quite well here at this site. Maybe not, but it certainly is possible.

In the end, I'm saying we don't have to be Nephis to stay LDS. Being Omnis is okay - and even honorable.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
SilentDawning
Posts: 7229
Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by SilentDawning » 25 Dec 2018, 09:38

If you want a cleaner version, something like this would be more fitting.

"I, [insert name], was once a faithful believer, but encountered faith crisis. Nonetheless, I supported my family and future generations in keeping the sacred record safe for passing on to my son. My hope is he will be true to his heart and beliefs and most of all, find happiness in his faith".
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

Curt Sunshine
Site Admin
Posts: 16610
Joined: 21 Oct 2008, 20:24

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by Curt Sunshine » 25 Dec 2018, 09:59

I like it.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

User avatar
DarkJedi
Posts: 6717
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by DarkJedi » 25 Dec 2018, 15:54

SilentDawning wrote:
25 Dec 2018, 09:38
If you want a cleaner version, something like this would be more fitting.

"I, [insert name], was once a faithful believer, but encountered faith crisis. Nonetheless, I supported my family and future generations in keeping the sacred record safe for passing on to my son. My hope is he will be true to his heart and beliefs and most of all, find happiness in his faith".
Also like. It is essentially what I have done and I am at peace with it, as is my believing wife and the children who it has affected. It has in fact brought us all closer.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

User avatar
SamBee
Posts: 5389
Joined: 14 Mar 2010, 04:55

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by SamBee » 26 Dec 2018, 06:26

The quote is contradictory. Obviously the man is not completely wicked otherwise he would not pass the record on... But I do not see it as justifying bad behavior otherwise, but duty which is slightly different. He did his duty but only in certain areas.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

User avatar
dande48
Posts: 1443
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: Omni 1:2-3 = Passing It on Is Enough

Post by dande48 » 26 Dec 2018, 14:16

SamBee wrote:
26 Dec 2018, 06:26
The quote is contradictory. Obviously the man is not completely wicked otherwise he would not pass the record on... But I do not see it as justifying bad behavior otherwise, but duty which is slightly different. He did his duty but only in certain areas.
Well, I'd say most everyone is a mix of good and bad. But in Omni's shoes, I don't think it'd require a lot of virtue to take your dad's journal, write a paragraph, and give it to your son. It wouldn't have to be more than an afterthought. Maybe a bit of nostalgia.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

Post Reply