Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Public forum for those seeking support for their experience in the LDS Church.
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LookingHard
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Joined: 20 Oct 2014, 12:11

Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by LookingHard » 10 Aug 2018, 15:18

Some good discussions on this over at Wheat & Tares

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DarkJedi
Posts: 5919
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by DarkJedi » 10 Aug 2018, 16:05

I have shared this and Sr. Wadsworth from the previous week (also inclusive and good) with the entire SPresidency and high council.

https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/lori-l-w ... in-others/ (text)
https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/lori-l-w ... thers/?M=V (video)
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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SilentDawning
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Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by SilentDawning » 10 Aug 2018, 16:09

dande48 wrote:
08 Aug 2018, 07:29
Bro Huntsman specifically pointed out, he wasn't referring to "safe spaces" in the way it is commonly used in society. He meant it in "creating environments that are, on the one hand, places of faith where we can seek and nurture testimony, but are also, on the other, places where our sisters and brothers can safely question and share their pain.
Could you argue that StayLDS qualifies as a Safe Space?
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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SilentDawning
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Joined: 09 May 2010, 19:55

Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by SilentDawning » 10 Aug 2018, 16:18

dande48 wrote:
08 Aug 2018, 07:29

One thing that's difficult for me, with the Church and religion in general, is how "religiously" it is followed. Any opposition is viewed as "of the devil". Criticizing or disagreeing with leadership (past or present) is viewed as apostasy. It's really difficult to come out and say "I don't believe in that, but I do believe in this." Heck, you can be denied a temple recommend for not believing in certain things. And not holding a temple recommend, you're placed in the "unworthy" camp, even if you're keeping all the other commandments.

I am tired of feeling like a second class citizen in Church. It is not an understanding and accepting place. Not for me.
I've made that aspect of it, for lack of a better word "fun". How I can make comments that express what I feel without making anyone upset. How I can survive in it without being miserable, etcetera. Keys to success, for me, are a) having this place, StayLDS to share my thoughts b) a rich personal life that is wholly independent on my church life and c) the satisfaction of knowing that I have managed to find happiness -- without the church in its intended format in my life.

Making a big sacrifice -- sitting on the steps of the temple when my daughter got married was an eye-opener. One, it showed me I could be unorthodox and on the fringes, yet there were few consequences. My family agreed with it, they don't hold it against me, there were a few raised eyebrows but I never see the eyebrow raisers (they are distant on the groom's side of the family) -- and no one said anything to me about it. And there was no fall out. I don't even miss not being there as it was apparently, a very standard kind of experience if memory serves, and my daughter suggested I stay outside if I would only get a TR for the wedding, as it looks like my wife did.

I would rather have been there, but if the church imposes rules on me that I can't keep, then I have found I can survive without them...

I think devaluing the prize of first class citizenship is part of it -- I sincerely don't care if I have it anymore. The world is wide and open with unlimited needs, and there are many communities in which to belong -- your work community, your friends, and those communities you create in community service and beyond. It is entirely possible to be oneself in it, provided you make the necessary adjustments. And quite frankly, church service is boring, repetitive, and no longer fulfilling for me...

Where I believe it gets difficult is when your spouse demands TBM behavior. I'm fortunate not to have that at this point.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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DarkJedi
Posts: 5919
Joined: 24 Aug 2013, 20:53

Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by DarkJedi » 10 Aug 2018, 16:34

SilentDawning wrote:
10 Aug 2018, 16:09
dande48 wrote:
08 Aug 2018, 07:29
Bro Huntsman specifically pointed out, he wasn't referring to "safe spaces" in the way it is commonly used in society. He meant it in "creating environments that are, on the one hand, places of faith where we can seek and nurture testimony, but are also, on the other, places where our sisters and brothers can safely question and share their pain.
Could you argue that StayLDS qualifies as a Safe Space?
Yes. We can say what we want about our questions and doubts here without fear of retribution. We don't do shout downs here. The caveat is of course that we do not tolerate blatant anti stuff, but why should we? There are safe places for that elsewhere.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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dande48
Posts: 963
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: Hard Sayings and Safe Spaces: Amazing BYU Devotional

Post by dande48 » 10 Aug 2018, 16:45

DarkJedi wrote:
10 Aug 2018, 16:34
SilentDawning wrote:
10 Aug 2018, 16:09
dande48 wrote:
08 Aug 2018, 07:29
Bro Huntsman specifically pointed out, he wasn't referring to "safe spaces" in the way it is commonly used in society. He meant it in "creating environments that are, on the one hand, places of faith where we can seek and nurture testimony, but are also, on the other, places where our sisters and brothers can safely question and share their pain.
Could you argue that StayLDS qualifies as a Safe Space?
Yes. We can say what we want about our questions and doubts here without fear of retribution. We don't do shout downs here. The caveat is of course that we do not tolerate blatant anti stuff, but why should we? There are safe places for that elsewhere.
If everyone on this site were to get together and form a ward, it'd be one where I'd be happy to attend every Sunday.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

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