Interesting Happening

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AmyJ
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Interesting Happening

Post by AmyJ » 02 Apr 2018, 07:36

Sunday morning/afternoon, my toddler was sick with a stomach bug [Kuddos (GROSS FACTOR WARNING): between her ability to learn motions and my attentiveness - she was able to throw up in the toilet several times instead of over everything. I am super proud of that accomplishment.].

We reached the point where it had been several hours since she had thrown up, so I was thinking it was time for her to have some apple juice and rest. We were also catching up on Saturday Evening's Priesthood session with President Nelson's "Bless People" talk recently played. I thought, "it would be nice if my husband gave the toddler a blessing - not needed because she will get over this in a few hours, but nice." just before I counseled with him regarding giving her some juice. I listened to his reasoning "just because a person has stopped having stomach issues, doesn't mean food/drink is a good idea" and presented my explanation that "she is toddler and has stopped apparently stopped having stomach issues, so it is vitally important that we start fluids soon so that she does not dehydrate even if some of them come back up. This is a real concern here." We decided to try to rock her to sleep and my husband vetoed my original apple juice idea. I was fine with that (for a few hours) - he has more expertise with stomach troubles than I do. So he rocks the baby, and I retreat because we have learned from experience that the toddler does not rock to sleep with the mommy. It's too exciting I guess.

5 minutes later he reports back, toddler in hand. He had decided to give her a father's blessing (without a word from me), and felt that part of that experience meant my suggestion was the best practice suggestion here - he cited that he received revelation to that point... The toddler is doing well, in fact had a second nap at 6 PM, and woke up at 7 PM all energized and ready to play.

SIDE NOTE: I am not interested in keeping commandments, so little lax in the dress department, little lax in the scripture reading department, and lax in the prayer department. Also, laxer in the Sunday Observance department (becoming a big fan of running laundry in the afternoon instead of killing myself doing 5 loads on Saturday). More importantly, my attitude is more along the lines of "God may or may not be involved, but I need to assign meaning to these areas in my life, and in how I do them rather than doing things that are meaningless (to me) because someone thought they were a good idea.".

So if it was "revelation" - why did I get it first? I am not living as "worthily" as my husband is. I can see it being "revelation" inasmuch as "mother's intuition" based on my "calling" as a mother - which would explain why I got it first... I can also see "inspiration/internal revelation" as words my husband is using to process my common sense choice into his newer faith-revitalized narrative.

This isn't a case of anyone being right or wrong, I just wonder what it is I am missing...

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DarkJedi
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by DarkJedi » 02 Apr 2018, 09:00

Just my 2 cents worth (but I'll give to you for free and you'll probably get what you paid for). In my own experience the stuff about being worthy of blessings or revelation or the Holy Ghost is all hoo-ha. If God wants to bless you or reveal something to you, God will do so and if God doesn't want to God won't. There is no scriptural mandate of worthiness that I have found. In other words, there is no scripture that says only the worthy have the companionship of the HG.
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

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dande48
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by dande48 » 02 Apr 2018, 11:19

AmyJ wrote:
02 Apr 2018, 07:36
So if it was "revelation" - why did I get it first?
Here are some possibilities:
-God doesn't care if you're worthy or not to receive revelation
-You were in the right mindset/keeping the commandments required to receive revelation at that time.
-It is your personal Gosh-Darn RIGHT as that child's mother to receive the revelation FIRST! Your husband needed to be taught the divine calling of MOTHERHOOD.
-Mysterious ways, don't try to understand them.

More possibilities (sans revelation):
-Subconscious/motherly intuition. You know that throwing up deprives the body of water and important electrolytes. You thought of apple juice as a potential solution. Your husband subconsciously realized that was a good idea, and took it for revelation.
-Semi-random guess. The longer anyone goes without fluids and food, the worse they will feel. Eventually, you would've given your toddler something. Heck, you didn't need revelation to rock her back to sleep, did you? I'm sure that made her feel better.

My personal thought: Revelation wasn't needed, so revelation wasn't given. Or maybe your husband needed revelation to go along with your non-revelatory idea.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

AmyJ
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by AmyJ » 02 Apr 2018, 11:39

dande48 wrote:
02 Apr 2018, 11:19
My personal thought: Revelation wasn't needed, so revelation wasn't given. Or maybe your husband needed revelation to go along with your non-revelatory idea.
I like this one the best. Especially since a recent "theme" in our lives has been that he has been focusing on being more respectful to us - which means in part overcoming his knee-jerk reaction to shoot my ideas down when he doesn't understand them intuitively/I don't communicate them well. We meet in the middle because I strive to find words to explain why I feel what I feel about something/conclusions I reached about something (in this case toddlers dehydrate sooner than adults, and toddler dehydration = bad news and is worse news than potentially throwing up again), and he "sulks" less (is more humble about and receptive to) new/differing ideas.

In terms of the blessing - while I don't know how they work, or if they work, or what the success rate of working is, I knew that it wouldn't hurt anything and could be another way to help our toddler. I dismissed it from out of hand because it wasn't a profoundly grave situation, so I didn't know if presenting it as a course of action would be a good idea (so I didn't). The fact that he came to the conclusion and acted on it makes me smile.

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DarkJedi
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by DarkJedi » 02 Apr 2018, 11:53

There's also the "on which all blessings are predicated" thing. We all sin, but at the same time we all obey lots of other commandments. If the blessing of receiving a revelation is related to a specific commandment you are keeping then you get that blessing, even though you might not be in compliance with a different commandment for which there is a different blessing. I know that's very orthodox, especially for me, but I also think lots of orthodox folks overlook that. While spouting (or pouting) about repentance they fail to see that even though they break the "keep the Sabbath holy" commandment, they are in total compliance with the do not murder, do not covet and do not steal commandments. Therefore, despite their feelings of "unworthiness" for not keeping the sabbath, they are still blessed for keeping the other 3.

(I now remove my orthodox hat and step off the "we misunderstand repentance" soapbox. :D )
In the absence of knowledge or faith there is always hope.

Once there was a gentile...who came before Hillel. He said "Convert me on the condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Hillel converted him, saying: That which is despicable to you, do not do to your fellow, this is the whole Torah, and the rest is commentary, go and learn it."

My Introduction

Curt Sunshine
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by Curt Sunshine » 02 Apr 2018, 17:23

Generally speaking, Mormons are FAR more "worthy" than they tend to believe.

I see your experience as revelation in its truest sense: having simething important "revealed" to you in some way. You tuned in to a talk that prompted an impression that led to a practical blessing for your child and a spiritual blessing for your husband. That is revelation at its core - not earth shattering and easy to dismiss, but important in a real way.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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dande48
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by dande48 » 03 Apr 2018, 06:52

DarkJedi wrote:
02 Apr 2018, 11:53
There's also the "on which all blessings are predicated" thing. We all sin, but at the same time we all obey lots of other commandments. If the blessing of receiving a revelation is related to a specific commandment you are keeping then you get that blessing, even though you might not be in compliance with a different commandment for which there is a different blessing.
I've heard this before, but it honestly feels like that doctrine is used to get us to follow Church leaders' revelation in spite of their wrongdoing. "Yes I've been wrong in X,Y, and Z, but this revelation is true!". It's as if anyone can receive revelation no matter what they do, or their desires. I do think good gospel truths can come from many sources. And I do think some commandments have a very concrete cause-effect relationship to their blessings (someone who doesn't drink will always be healthier than someone who does, all else being equal).

But I'm VERY hesitant to accept at face value anything declared as God-given revelation. If God is giving revelation, He seems very fickle. Maybe I don't understand his ways; but I have to act according to my understanding.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

Curt Sunshine
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by Curt Sunshine » 03 Apr 2018, 06:55

Feiw, the Bible Dictionary states clearly that anyone can receive revelation - which means we tend to limit the word too much to massive, miraculous experiences.

I like viewing revelation in an expansive way, even as I understand the danger in applying it too broadly.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

Roy
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Re: Interesting Happening

Post by Roy » 03 Apr 2018, 10:26

FWIW, I appreciate if my wife asks me for a blessing or suggests that I give a blessing to the kids. To me it means that she respects me and sees me as a "worthy" husband and father. This is especially meaningful to me since my faith crisis.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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