How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

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nibbler
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by nibbler » 15 Jan 2018, 06:51

SilentDawning wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 15:11
You also have your own fallibility to worry about. I have a certain amount of doubt in my own sensitibilities. I have been wrong in the past, and it's possible I'm wrong about my approach to this Mormon thing. Leave yourself open for the future given all the unproveables surrounding religion.
The way I look at it... I look back and see how I was wrong in the past. That helps me look forward to see how I'm wrong in the present. That means I'm always wrong, and that's a comforting thought. I'd hate to be right about some of the stuff that goes through my brain. ;)
You can't just have your characters announce how they feel... that makes me feel ANGRY!
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nibbler
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by nibbler » 15 Jan 2018, 07:02

Beefster wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 18:29
Things get particularly hairy with my calling as a Ward Missionary.
That's a tough calling to have for someone in your position. These days I simply wouldn't accept that calling, but it has more to do with me having had that calling for far too many years in the past. I'm "done" with that particular calling.

But one way to look at it is that the LDS church really can bless the lives of some people. The church is positioned to fill that spiritual gap in their lives. I think the mistake we make as a church is in assuming that the church is for everyone. Maybe the mistake we make on the other side is in assuming that the church is for no one. But reality is somewhere in the middle.

There's someone out there that could benefit from joining or coming back to the church. As a ward missionary I could get behind helping them do that... but it's got to be something that they want to do, not something that the ward missionaries want them to do. But that goes back to authenticity, my authenticity accounts for other people's authenticity. If they want to come back to church I can support them in that goal. If not, I have to fall back on that live-and-let-live attitude... even if it means getting an earful from the ward mission leader or bishop or whoever that by their estimation I'm not "magnifying" the calling in the way they believe I should be magnifying it.
You can't just have your characters announce how they feel... that makes me feel ANGRY!
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SilentDawning
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by SilentDawning » 15 Jan 2018, 08:32

See, I wouldn't accept that call unless it was to give people rides or having people over for dinner. and even then I'd have to think about it really hard before agreeing. There is NO WAY I am recruiting people to our religion given the ways I've had to suffer within our gospel of happiness...

The Ward missionary, in its fullest job description, is exactly the kind of calling I think someone with really unorthodox views or doubt should avoid. To accept such a calling is to pit oneself against those doubts and create that inner tension the opening post seems to be articulating.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"Stage 5 is where you no longer believe the gospel as its literally or traditionally taught. Nonetheless, you find your own way to be active and at peace within it". -- SD

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1576

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Beefster
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by Beefster » 15 Jan 2018, 11:30

Thing is, it started as a "teach Gospel Principles" calling. I was reluctant to accept at the time because the faith transition was already in full swing at the time. But my conditioning meant I said yes. Now I'm being roped into calling members (active or not) to have them feed the missionaries (which is a great idea BTW and a much better way to feed them than passing around a calendar). I like the idea, but I'm not sure I'm the right person for the job. I made sure to ask for a Do Not Contact list because I don't want to have to deal with angry people who want nothing to do with the church. I hope the ward gets another ward missionary or two so I can pawn off the responsibility. I guess I'll just try to make the best of it and apply my preach-free brand of missionary work.

I have great ideas about how to approach missionary work in my ward, but yeah... the calling definitely pits me against my own heterodoxy. It's a calling I would have loved to have even just a year ago, but right now, it's very complicated.

If it gets too complicated I'll just have to figure out the best way of asking to be released.
Boys are governed by rules. Men are governed by principles.

Sometimes our journeys take us to unexpected places. That is a truly beautiful thing.

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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by Roy » 16 Jan 2018, 12:24

nibbler wrote:
15 Jan 2018, 07:02
But one way to look at it is that the LDS church really can bless the lives of some people. The church is positioned to fill that spiritual gap in their lives. I think the mistake we make as a church is in assuming that the church is for everyone. Maybe the mistake we make on the other side is in assuming that the church is for no one. But reality is somewhere in the middle.
I agree with this. Some people could be very much helped by the church. Others have the personality to flourish in the church culture and organization.

If I were a ward missionary, I would focus on having well run social activities. I believe people will want to join an organization were they feel connected. Social activities increase connection.

I do see where it could be hard serving as a ward missionary teaching investigators/new members. I am not exactly sure what I would do if a Missionary turned to me and said "Bro. Roy could you share your testimony of the First Vision?" I do not know that I could honestly say what the Missionary wants me to. "I honestly believe that something happened in those woods that left a big impact on the worldview of JS. I believe that he was still trying to figure it out and define its significance years afterwards." Is probably not going to cut it. :thumbdown:
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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Beefster
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by Beefster » 16 Jan 2018, 19:48

Roy wrote:
16 Jan 2018, 12:24
I do see where it could be hard serving as a ward missionary teaching investigators/new members. I am not exactly sure what I would do if a Missionary turned to me and said "Bro. Roy could you share your testimony of the First Vision?" I do not know that I could honestly say what the Missionary wants me to. "I honestly believe that something happened in those woods that left a big impact on the worldview of JS. I believe that he was still trying to figure it out and define its significance years afterwards." Is probably not going to cut it. :thumbdown:
I've helped the missionaries with one lesson since my FC started, and I got around that problem by "testifying" regularly about the things I could get behind. The restoration lesson is definitely harder to tag along for than the others. I can generally get behind those (maybe not so much the WoW, at least from the commandment point of view).

The church espouses some pretty fantastic doctrines. It just teaches many of them wrong. :P
Boys are governed by rules. Men are governed by principles.

Sometimes our journeys take us to unexpected places. That is a truly beautiful thing.

AmyJ
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Re: How to Resolve Feelings of Intellectual Dishonesty

Post by AmyJ » 17 Jan 2018, 08:16

Roy wrote:
16 Jan 2018, 12:24
I agree with this. Some people could be very much helped by the church. Others have the personality to flourish in the church culture and organization.

If I were a ward missionary, I would focus on having well run social activities. I believe people will want to join an organization were they feel connected. Social activities increase connection.
I feel the best ward missionaries would show acceptance/not judge those who don't want to do social stuff. My family attends church for all 3 hours about 3-4 times out of a 6 week period. I attend R.S. functions about 1x every 6 months. My daughter attends Achievement Days because someone goes out of their way to pick her up and it is new for us. We don't do potlucks - my husband can't eat what members provide due to sodium content and embarrassed to only eat what he brings.

Now making sure that individuals are connected by facebook or other social media... that is valuable to me.
Roy wrote:
16 Jan 2018, 12:24
I do see where it could be hard serving as a ward missionary teaching investigators/new members. I am not exactly sure what I would do if a Missionary turned to me and said "Bro. Roy could you share your testimony of the First Vision?" I do not know that I could honestly say what the Missionary wants me to. "I honestly believe that something happened in those woods that left a big impact on the worldview of JS. I believe that he was still trying to figure it out and define its significance years afterwards." Is probably not going to cut it. :thumbdown:
Well, you are guaranteed that that missionary is only going to ask you that question 1x :clap:

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