1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

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wayfarer
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by wayfarer » 30 Jun 2015, 06:06

Except it doesn't appear to be for sacrament meeting. That is strange to me.

It does appear to me more of a legal position vis-a-vis "religious liberty"--putting a stake in the ground about allowing the church the freedom to discriminate against those who wish to live authentically as both a LBGT and a Mormon.
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SilentDawning
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by SilentDawning » 30 Jun 2015, 06:09

wayfarer wrote:Except it doesn't appear to be for sacrament meeting. That is strange to me.

It does appear to me more of a legal position vis-a-vis "religious liberty"--putting a stake in the ground about allowing the church the freedom to discriminate against those who wish to live authentically as both a LBGT and a Mormon.
Good point -- particularly about the freedom aspect of it.
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Ann
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by Ann » 30 Jun 2015, 07:55

If your counselor reads it, maybe a silent but sizable minority of your members will think, "Hmm. Why did the bishop turn the time over to Bro. X? Maybe the bishop is someone I can talk to."

And....I just noticed that my tag line was made for a moment like this. I'm not trying to be dramatic, but I've got two kids here at home who'll be questioning their futures in the church after this heavy-handed event. These kids have way too many gay friends to successfully digest this kind of rhetoric, because it's not just sticking to the marriage issue. The background materials are back to the unacceptability of any homosexual behavior. My daughter, who just called her gay friend for a ride when stranded at work yesterday, is not going to say, " Yup. My good friend should live his whole life without even holding another man's hand." I really think the preachers are erring here, but time will tell.
"Preachers err by trying to talk people into belief; better they reveal the radiance of their own discovery." - Joseph Campbell

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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by nibbler » 30 Jun 2015, 08:23

DarkJedi wrote:I am assuming it's one of those "to be read in sacrament meeting" letters. I'm with those who wouldn't have a problem reading it, you are being the messenger of the Q15 and that's pretty clear. You could even make it clearer by way of introduction. Like others have said I also don't agree with much of it. If you really can't do it have a counselor do it - you are still the bishop and people who do have questions/issues should default to you anyway. Reading it in sacrament meeting has a huge advantage - there is no feedback or Q&A there normally.
The text in the image reads:
Local leaders are asked to meet with all adults, young men, and young women on either July 5 or July 12 in a setting other than sacrament meeting and read to them the entire statement.
That's very specific. Apparently they don't want to expose the primary children to the letter. It's PG-13. :P

In practice I'm guessing the BP and his counselors will probably meet with one group each during the third hour. One can corner the entire PH body during opening exercises, another the RS, and another the YW.

If you're the one reading the letter you have license to add. dramatic. flair. to the portions you like and breezeovertheportionsyoudon'twanttosinkin.

Looks like I'm going to miss the event entirely. :( Missed it by one week. I'd love for the BP to open up the floor to questions and comments.
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by Curt Sunshine » 30 Jun 2015, 08:54

My brother-in-law wrote the following that I thought people here might like to read.

"Missing Church in July" (https://medium.com/@ungewissen/missing- ... 8e90931ee1)

My favorite part is the ending:
You have consistently shown kindness and patience with me and my family, and I appreciate that. I hope you will discern my respect for you, even when we see things differently.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by nibbler » 30 Jun 2015, 09:04

Now that's a good letter. I'd be tempted to stand up during PH and read that as my "rebuttal." :smile:
If one dream dies, dream another dream. If you get knocked down, get back up and go again.
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Roadrunner
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by Roadrunner » 30 Jun 2015, 09:55

Ray DeGraw wrote:What else can be expected right now?

There is nothing new in this letter
I didn't really expect much else, but I was hoping for the Church's PR statement the day after SCOTUS would be all we heard about it until conference. The letter itself, which is the only portion signed by the Q15, is somewhat less difficult to swallow than the background information provided as a guide to answer questions. I think some of the background quotes are tone deaf.

To me intellectual honesty and being true to myself is very important. One of my biggest fears is being put in a situation where I will have to be completely open and blunt in public, which I feel could be disastrous for my family relationships.

Also I know several members of my ward who struggle with this tremendously. I have gay family members who married a member of the opposite sex and had children hoping the power of the atonement would be enough to heal them. The marriage was a disaster and left a trail of devastation those kids will have to deal with for the rest of their lives. There are gay teenagers in my ward who feel hopeless, knowing they will have to choose between physical / sexual needs and family / church support. I'm crying as I type this because I simply feel bad for them.

I view SCOTUS as a victory for gay people but this letter as a squandered opportunity for the church to reach out more.

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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by Roy » 30 Jun 2015, 10:06

I know this is a serious tangent... One of the ideas that I seriously disagree with in Mormondom is that if your spouse does not make the celestial cut then you can simply be matched with someone else. I dislike it so because it implies that physical anatomy and dedication to the Mormon cause are what matters. A lifetime of growing together and raising kids together? Not so much. So with that as a backdrop, I cherry picked the following statement:
Mothers and fathers matter, and they are not interchangeable.
:clap:
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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by hawkgrrrl » 30 Jun 2015, 10:11

I've got two kids here at home who'll be questioning their futures in the church after this heavy-handed event. These kids have way too many gay friends to successfully digest this kind of rhetoric, because it's not just sticking to the marriage issue.
My kids are in the same boat. My oldest has already bailed. My kids have consistently stood up against bullying and joined the GSA groups in their schools. In the school in Singapore, there was an anti-bullying day and kids were supposed to wear purple to support. My son wore purple, but one of the other Mormon boys refused to wear it because he said it was a political statement that was "pro-gay" and therefore against the church. I'm sure that kid was getting that from home, and I'm sure his parents would have said the same about my son wearing purple. There's so much privilege tied up in our worship sometimes. We really can't seem to see past the Wasatch front middle class white people attitudes that have been the bread and butter of the church. I often wonder whether we just attract those who aspire to a white middle class lifestyle, not those who truly want to understand and live the gospel of Jesus. We seem incapable of thinking globally.

I don't know whether church leaders don't see what this kind of stance does to our youth, who empathize with and support gay people, or simply don't care. It's the war of the older generation on the younger, and thus it ever was. Rage, rage, against the dying of the light.
Mothers and fathers matter, and they are not interchangeable.
Try again, Roy. They are not "interchangeable" with each other, but all women are interchangeable with all other women, and all men are interchangeable with all other men. That's the real meaning of that. It's bonkers, but so it is.

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Re: 1st Presidency Letter - supposed to read to all members

Post by Curt Sunshine » 30 Jun 2015, 10:17

I view SCOTUS as a victory for gay people but this letter as a squandered opportunity for the church to reach out more.


Yep.

This truly is a generational thing, and that is what saddens me most. We can't afford to lose the very people who would help us progress and move toward what I believe is a more Christ-like organization that is more truly Zion.

I'm doing my best to help my own kids be there when they can make the most difference, and I am doing my best to do the same for others in the generations below me.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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