Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

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SunbeltRed
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Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by SunbeltRed » 24 Dec 2014, 11:24

My DW and I had a pretty intense conversation yesterday about my faith journey, what it means to her, what does it mean about our marriage - I think I forget sometimes that I am not the only one processing but she is as well.

I have talked in general/broad terms with her about where I am. It's been a pretty open line, but I have held back on sharing any of the details. I don't want to be responsible for what might happen if she starts to learn some of the details. But yesterday she said she wants me to share the things I read/have read with her and let her come to her own conclusions. Her views and opinions might not change, I have no idea. People react in all kinds of different ways.

I don't want to drop a crazy amount of information on her at once so wondering if there are certain podcasts, articles, that do a good job of presenting the complicated issues?

I am starting to make a list of specific podcasts that were meaningful and possibly challenging to me. But am interested in getting others perspectives.

Roy
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by Roy » 24 Dec 2014, 11:47

I don't listen to podcasts but if it were me I might start with the new essays on LDS.org. I might schedule a night each week to read an essay and talk about it together. If a particular essay warrants multiple weeks of discussion then so be it.

I might suppliment the essay itself with information from "In Sacred Lonliness", RSR, or Mormon Enigma. This would be to point out that even in acknowledging the issues in an out of the way portion of the website the church in the essays seems to be taking the best/ most faith promoting slant possible given the history.

My goal would not be to change my wife's faith orientation and therefore I would only broach topics that are from more reputable church related sources. My goal would be for her to understand how discovering this information could be very hard for someone who believed the literal orthodox narrative and that you are doing your best to build your faith with what was still servicable after the former structure collapsed.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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mom3
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by mom3 » 24 Dec 2014, 13:31

As the spouse who went through it, TAKE IT SLOW. Even when we want information we want it at our own speed in our own time.

That said I have seen spouses who when given a little information get really fired up, eat the entire enchilada, and then the tables turn.

Looking back I wish I had been asked what I wanted to learn about. Certain things are nearer and dearer to each person and extra baggage doesn't help. Let her run the discussion, ask the questions, even when she asks take a few personal deep breaths, think before you respond and go slow with the info. Try to stay to facts and not your opinion.

Good luck. May it go well.

This is the next area that needs concerted effort - spouses and families. There are no podcasts, blogsites, or recommendations. It's every family for themselves on this.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

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Holy Cow
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by Holy Cow » 24 Dec 2014, 15:12

Great topic! This is a very slippery slope! My wife's head was spinning the first time I told her I was having doubts, and she wouldn't talk to me for three days. And my doubts have only multiplied since then. Time has taught me the value of taking it slow, and only offering as much as she wants to hear, as others have said. I don't listen to podcasts, and I wouldn't use them as source material for somebody with questions, but that's only my personal opinion. I prefer to use books, because I like having the notes and references, so I can look up where the sources are coming from. When I'm listening to a podcast, I always finding myself thinking, "How baised is the information I'm listening to, and where did it come from?" If I can look at the references, I can determine how credible it is. If I'm reading something that is using somebody like Fawn Brodie or John C Bennett, then I scrutinize that material a little more than I would from others, because they had an axe to grind. Personally, when my wife has questions, I tell her where I read something and leave it to her to look it up herself. That way she can read as much as she wants, but can stop when she wants to. I also do my best to find books that are balanced, and simply tell the history as it was, and don't have a negative slant, or a positive slant. I just want the simple truth, without having the author giving me half of the information that's available and then telling me what I should think about it. I feel like that's what the church has done with a lot of information, and I want to just read the original source material wherever possible and come to my own conclusions. And I want my wife to be able to do the same. So, I don't push anything on her, and I answer whatever questions she has about my personal feelings, but I don't use it as an opportunity throw back the curtain and expose the wizard of Oz. I just point to the curtain and let her decide for herself whether or not she wants to take a peek. And, like I said, this is just my approach. It will be different for everybody, depending on your specific situation.
My introduction: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6139

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SilentDawning
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by SilentDawning » 24 Dec 2014, 15:16

I agree with taking it slow. Don't throw all the cold water at once. A few drops here and there.

I would give the most important, broad categories and ask your spouse to ask you questions about it. Provide resources that fit her interests.
"It doesn't have to be about the Church (church) all the time!" -- SD

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. No price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself."

A man asked Jesus "do all roads lead to you?" Jesus responds,”most roads don’t lead anywhere, but I will travel any road to find you.” Adapted from The Shack, William Young

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DBMormon
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by DBMormon » 25 Dec 2014, 07:25

I would start with the essays. Then I would provide a faithful reasoning (FairMormon, MormonDiscussion, Jeff Lindsay, etc..) and a Critical Reasoning (mormonthink, ces letter, etc...) and let her make up her own mind. The essays validate the troublesome facts and the context can be decided by her. my thoughts only

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mackay11
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by mackay11 » 26 Dec 2014, 17:30

Wikipedia is a surprisingly good place to work through some of the big issues. They go into more detail than the LDS.org essays but don't carry the same "snidey" spin of a CES letter or mormonthink.

The advantage of Wikipedia is they are fully referenced for further reading and have both "pro" and "con" editors working on the content and agreeing edits. It has an established system for "right to reply" that few other websites provide.

Personally I wouldn't let her anywhere near mormonthink or CES letter. I don't like either and think CES letter in particular is a massive over-simplification of nearly every single skeleton in Mormonism's closet.


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mackay11
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by mackay11 » 26 Dec 2014, 17:53

It's worth saying that the best thing about Wikipedia is the requirement to provide sources. If possible, click through and read the source behind the claim being made. Sometimes I discount claims based on weak sources.

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SunbeltRed
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Re: Introducing DW to some of the tough issues

Post by SunbeltRed » 26 Dec 2014, 19:44

Thanks for the advice!

Hope everyone had a merry Christmas!

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