are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

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MockingJay
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by MockingJay » 20 Jul 2014, 07:41

GBSmith wrote:I've been told by a couple of different folks that there's no requirement to wear garments under bra and panties. Shouldn't that make some difference? And as far as my earlier link, not wearing them at all when appropriate seems to be a reasonable option. :D
I can vouch for the fact that this is true.

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SamBee
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by SamBee » 20 Jul 2014, 08:21

I'm wearing a bra and panties just now, and I am not wearing my garments over them.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

Curt Sunshine
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Curt Sunshine » 20 Jul 2014, 08:29

Oh, Sam. :roll:
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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Katzpur
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Katzpur » 20 Jul 2014, 09:09

GBSmith wrote:I've been told by a couple of different folks that there's no requirement to wear garments under bra and panties. Shouldn't that make some difference? And as far as my earlier link, not wearing them at all when appropriate seems to be a reasonable option. :D
I know that when you go to the temple for the first time, you're told that they should be worn "next to the skin," which implies that they should be "under bra and panties." (I personally can't imagine wearing underpants along with garments, but that's beside the point.) One of my closest friends is so flat-chested that a bra simply will not stay in place if she wears is on top of her garments. She wears it under her garments and does so with a clear conscience. Honestly, why would God really care?
"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." ~Rudyard Kipling ~

Roy
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Roy » 20 Jul 2014, 09:55

Katzpur wrote:
GBSmith wrote:I've been told by a couple of different folks that there's no requirement to wear garments under bra and panties. Shouldn't that make some difference? And as far as my earlier link, not wearing them at all when appropriate seems to be a reasonable option. :D
I know that when you go to the temple for the first time, you're told that they should be worn "next to the skin," which implies that they should be "under bra and panties." (I personally can't imagine wearing underpants along with garments, but that's beside the point.) One of my closest friends is so flat-chested that a bra simply will not stay in place if she wears is on top of her garments. She wears it under her garments and does so with a clear conscience. Honestly, why would God really care?
When I went to the temple for my own endowment about 15 years ago they told me that they used to tell initiates that, but that they were longer permitted to. Instead it is to be left to the understanding and conscience of the individual. I was given the impression that it was a new thing that had come down from leadership. I hope that it was an institutional change and not just local.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

Curt Sunshine
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Curt Sunshine » 20 Jul 2014, 15:55

My daughter asked specifically when she went through the temple for the first time about two years ago in an area not near Roy's (against my advice, but I'm used to that :P ), and she was told it is completely up to her.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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MockingJay
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by MockingJay » 21 Jul 2014, 04:26

Ray DeGraw wrote:My daughter asked specifically when she went through the temple for the first time about two years ago in an area not near Roy's (against my advice, but I'm used to that :P ), and she was told it is completely up to her.
This is true church-wide now. Unfortunately, women who went through the temple years ago are not brought up to speed on this. I wouldn't have known if I didn't work in the temple.

ShipwreckLo
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by ShipwreckLo » 21 Jul 2014, 09:47

My daughter asked specifically when she went through the temple for the first time about two years ago in an area not near Roy's (against my advice, but I'm used to that :P ), and she was told it is completely up to her.
I specifically asked the question 7 months ago, and was told the bra should go over, and that the garment should be the closest thing to the skin.
This is true church-wide now.
False - See above.

All that being said, I think it is ridiculous to expect women to embed scratchy symbols into their, ahem, sensitive parts. There are some weeks where I can barely wear clothes, let alone dig embroidering into myself. No thank you.

Curt Sunshine
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Curt Sunshine » 21 Jul 2014, 09:56

"False"

No, not false. That is the official, church-wide policy now (it's up to the individual), but some temple workers still repeat the old policy. That happens with lots of things, inside and outside the LDS Church. (continuing old practices / policies after new ones have been initiated) It's unfortunate, but it's unavoidable, given our human inclination to hold onto what we learned and resist change.

As I said in the other current thread, this is one thing (not wearing the garment beneath regular underwear) people can change without being in opposition to current policy. The current policy is that each member can determine exactly how s/he wears the garment, as long as it is worn "throughout your life" and in a way that does not "defile" it.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

Roy
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Re: are garments getting your panties in a bunch, too?

Post by Roy » 21 Jul 2014, 10:02

ShipwreckLo does have a point. I'm sure some still teach that it should be next to your skin and daughters are recieving hand-me-down instruction from their mothers etc.

DW knows that it is up to her but she still wears it under her bra as was the norm in her formative household.

Perhaps for some women telling them they have a choice in how they wear their garment is like telling them that they have a choice to wear pants to church on Sunday. Not stricly prohibited but most make the "better" choice of keeping it close to the skin.
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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