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Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 03 Oct 2019, 23:00
by Tica
Interesting thread. I love that DatkJedi looked up the original context of that quote, and I love how it changed the meaning for me. I realized that I have been operating at least partially under the subconscious assumption that if my kids don't turn out to be good LDS then I have failed. Failure is a harsh word to apply to such a complicated task as parenting. Minyan Man, if I achieve a similar result to yours with my kiddos as they grow, I will definitely consider it a success.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 01 Mar 2020, 11:33
by bridget_night
I distinctly remember this saying. I remember telling my husband this saying when he was so busy with callings in the church that he had no time for me or the kids. My husband believed that doing his church callings was putting the Lord first. He equated the church with God. I felt like a married single and our kids felt like dad just came home enough to reel out harsh discipline. I became resentful of him and the church. We hardly had a sex life and I felt like he no longer needed or desired me. I hated going to the temple because it made me realize I did not want this man for eternity. I blamed him more than I blamed the church because he could have stopped this. But, he believed the church taught that putting your callings first was putting God first,so that is what he did. It almost destroyed our marriage and had a very bad effect on our kids for some time. Only after he realized the church was not God and put our marriage and family first (with alot of counseling) did we survive. So, I do believe the lds church gives out mixed messages to families. If you read back in lds church history when men were called on missions for many years and left their sick wives and children to take care of the farm, you can see where members can get the message that family and marriage does not come first.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 17 Mar 2020, 13:42
by Khadijah
I'm so bad...

The only reasons that I attend Church is to receive the Sacrament, and to worship God with other believers in him full stop.

So much of the dogma they try to dish out is straight up nonsense. I love the members and their devotion. For me the Leadership have missed the boat. I don't know if they will ever get it right. They try to put themselves between God and I, and for me Jesus is the only one that can do that. Trust in authority is simply not in me. There are good reasons for that. The Believers are the only important part of the Church.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 17 Mar 2020, 15:22
by DarkJedi
Khadijah wrote:
17 Mar 2020, 13:42
I'm so bad...

The only reasons that I attend Church is to receive the Sacrament, and to worship God with other believers in him full stop.

So much of the dogma they try to dish out is straight up nonsense. I love the members and their devotion. For me the Leadership have missed the boat. I don't know if they will ever get it right. They try to put themselves between God and I, and for me Jesus is the only one that can do that. Trust in authority is simply not in me. There are good reasons for that. The Believers are the only important part of the Church.
Then I guess I'm bad too - and I'm a high councilor.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 17 Mar 2020, 17:01
by Khadijah
I'll try to be respectful then. Trust is a ways out. Sorry, having been violated...

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 17 Mar 2020, 17:44
by DarkJedi
Khadijah wrote:
17 Mar 2020, 17:01
I'll try to be respectful then. Trust is a ways out. Sorry, having been violated...
No worries and please, one of the things that really bugs me about some members of the church is the undue deference given others because of their assignment. I even detest standing for the president of the church.

I don't go to church for social reasons or to socialize. I find meaning in the Sacrament of the Lord's Supper and I hope to be edified by the rest (but I'm often disappointed). I totally agree with your point of view.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 17 Mar 2020, 18:39
by Khadijah
Thank you. Perhaps that will smooth the path between us?

In my absence from the church, I investigated as many of the old family stories as I could remember. A Sister in the Church told me that my Mother's side of the family married a Mormon in 1860, I think in Arizona, or New Mexico? So, right before the start of the Civil War. One of the family stories is that one side of the family grew up in Oklahoma, and that my Father was full blooded Native American and was born and raised on one of the 39 Reservations there. The marrying a Mormon story strongly implies that they were mixing with Native Americans because the wave of settlers had not started yet? Gold was discovered in California in 1848 so perhaps substantial traffic to California had developed.

These days, I feel that I am at least half Apache, or Navajo. Exploring Native American belief systems, it seems that some of it is very good.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 16 Apr 2020, 19:31
by TinSoldier
Man alive, I could be in deep water over the whole failure in the home. I had a divorce about the time my oldest was 18 and my youngest (I have 4 kids) was about 11. I don't feel like I had much choice with the divorce. My ex had recently announced that, after nearly 20 years and fou kids, that she never really preferred men, then descended to claiming that I had made her lesbian. It was ugly and not the sort of problem that's likely to be sorted out in counseling, though we did try that a few times over the years. I held a standard that my problems with her were my problems, not the kids, and felt it would be to their advantage to have a positive relationship with their mother if possible. She didn't and engaged in a boatload of toxic propaganda against me with the kids. Long story short, today I don't think any of them speak to their mother. I have a good relationship with my oldest son, but that's it. I have messaged with my oldest daughter on facebook a handful of times over the past few years, but even that's strained badly, but the younger two kids have blocked me entirely. I won't claim I didn't make mistakes, but I don't feel I deserved to be cut off to this extent.

Re: Should I feel guilty?

Posted: 19 Apr 2020, 12:51
by Roy
I am sorry to hear that Tinsoldier. I am sure that is painful. Sometimes life gives us impossible situations. God knows our pain and our hearts. I believe that He will hold us in his arms in a future day and we will be overwhelmed with his understanding and compassion for us.