What I Want -

For the discussion of spirituality -- from LDS and non-LDS sources
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mom3
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What I Want -

Post by mom3 » 11 Feb 2019, 15:30

"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

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dande48
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Re: What I Want -

Post by dande48 » 12 Feb 2019, 08:32

I don't think this would be effective for a few reasons:
-Horrible is a very strong word.
-Referring to other people horrible will never be productive.
-People do not recognize themselves as horrible, even when they do bad things.
-People are not intrinsically horrible. God does not see anyone as horrible. Actions, yes. People, no.
-It doesn't seem very kind to the people the author specifically considers horrible. It feels judgmental towards them, despite the fact he wants them to be less judgmental of others. It will not win over any of those who disagree with him.

But things I do like:
-Focus on virtue over doctrine.
-Kindness and compassion.
-Charity, which I define as assuming the least alarming, least troublesome reason behind people acting the way they do.

If I were to start a church, it would be the "Church of Being Kind".
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

Roy
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Re: What I Want -

Post by Roy » 12 Feb 2019, 10:22

I know the author is not literally starting a church but, for the sake of argument, the church that he is talking about might have trouble being successful.

No creeds, no doctrine, no financial donations? How is the church supposed to function?

No heavenly mansions, no escaping hellfire, no strong community of believers? Why would someone want to join such a church? What's in it for them?

Someone said on another post (was it you Mom?) that the threads of religion need to be formed or woven into a fabric in order to be useful. Churches take the good of compassion and service and create a self-perpetuating structure and organization (subject to many of the same pitfalls and foibles of most organizations).
"It is not so much the pain and suffering of life which crushes the individual as it is its meaninglessness and hopelessness." C. A. Elwood

“It is not the function of religion to answer all the questions about God’s moral government of the universe, but to give one courage, through faith, to go on in the face of questions he never finds the answer to in his present status.” TPC: Harold B. Lee 223

"I struggle now with establishing my faith that God may always be there, but may not always need to intervene" Heber13

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mom3
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Re: What I Want -

Post by mom3 » 12 Feb 2019, 16:48

Good observations everyone.

I am in a dark spot. It's obvious from all of my recent posts.

The dark got darker last Friday when someone amazing and dear, died unexpectedly.

I appreciate your keener insights.

I will take some time off for a while.
"I stayed because it was God and Jesus Christ that I wanted to follow and be like, not individual human beings." Chieko Okazaki Dialogue interview

"I am coming to envision a new persona for the Church as humble followers of Jesus Christ....Joseph and his early followers came forth with lots of triumphalist rhetoric, but I think we need a new voice, one of humility, friendship and service. We should teach people to believe in God because it will soften their hearts and make them more willing to serve." - Richard Bushman

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dande48
Posts: 1443
Joined: 24 Jan 2016, 16:35
Location: Wherever there is danger

Re: What I Want -

Post by dande48 » 12 Feb 2019, 20:09

I'm sorry to hear that, Mom. I hope you know it's very understandable the way you're feeling right now. You're a wonderful person. I've got faith you'll make it through.
"The whole world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel." - Horace Walpole

"Even though there are no ways of knowing for sure, there are ways of knowing for pretty sure."
-Lemony Snicket

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