Elizabeth Smart: Forgiveness is another word for self-love

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Re: Elizabeth Smart: Forgiveness is another word for self-love

Post by SamBee » 19 Jun 2018, 04:47

I was thinking more about this case. I don't think it is something which was destined to happen to her, because it was the free agency of her captors that caused it but more a case of alchemy - i.e. turning poisonous lead into gold. Maybe we all need to learn how to transform our bad experiences into "gold".

It brings me back to "Adam fell that men might be" - turning horror into beauty.
Adam fell that men might be; and men are, that they might have joy.

And the Messiah cometh in the fulness of time, that he may redeem the children of men from the fall. And because that they are redeemed from the fall they have become free forever, knowing good from evil; to act for themselves and not to be acted upon, save it be by the punishment of the law at the great and last day, according to the commandments which God hath given.

Wherefore, men are free according to the flesh; and all things are given them which are expedient unto man. And they are free to choose liberty and eternal life, through the great Mediator of all men, or to choose captivity and death, according to the captivity and power of the devil; for he seeketh that all men might be miserable like unto himself.
I take out of this that:
1 - A bad act can be redeemed and turned into something positive, whether it is our own or someone else's.
2 - That we are responsible for our own free agency. What others do to us is not necessarily our fault.
3 - Evil seeks to make us miserable, because as the old saying goes "misery loves company". Though evil acts upon us, it mustn't be allowed to bully us onto its side.
DASH1730 "An Area Authority...[was] asked...who...would go to the Telestial kingdom. His answer: "murderers, adulterers and a lot of surprised Mormons!"'
1ST PRES 1978 "[LDS] believe...there is truth in many religions and philosophies...good and great religious leaders... have raised the spiritual, moral, and ethical awareness of their people. When we speak of The [LDS] as the only true church...it is...authorized to administer the ordinances...by Jesus Christ... we do not mean... it is the only teacher of truth."

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Re: Elizabeth Smart: Forgiveness is another word for self-love

Post by Heber13 » 21 Jun 2018, 10:33

SamBee wrote:
19 Jun 2018, 04:47
I don't think it is something which was destined to happen to her,
I totally reject any story or thought that would suggest such horror was supposed to happen to teach people lessons. What a horrible way to learn things in this mortal life!!!

I think, as you said, we can turn bad things into good things. Or we can't. Some things are simply out of our control.

Things happen in this life. Random things.

The God of the universe allows it. Many many families suffer from having children taken, and never returned, no matter how hard they pray.

But...this life gives us opportunities to be resilient and choose each day who we will serve, what we make of today and going forward with the circumstances we find ourselves in. There is not always a sufficient answer to "why this happened?"...simply a choice to deal with the day today we have control of to make choices we find ourselves.
Matt 6:34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow[or yesterday]: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
I think part of forgiveness is embracing the truth that some things are not within our control. Let go of it. And move forward. Stay present.
Luke: "Why didn't you tell me? You told me Vader betrayed and murdered my father."
Obi-Wan: "Your father... was seduced by the dark side of the Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalker and became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
Luke: "A certain point of view?"
Obi-Wan: "Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to...depend greatly on our point of view."

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Re: Elizabeth Smart: Forgiveness is another word for self-love

Post by Curt Sunshine » 21 Jun 2018, 13:41

Believing bad things happen for a divinely-inspired reason is a privilege of people who don't face devastating and unbearable lives. (Specific events? Yes. Lives? No.) In practical terms, that view minimizes the pain of those who suffer the most, by imagining such suffering ultimately is good for them. Someone who is tortured over a long time and then killed generally doesn't learn or grow from the experience. Someone whose child is slaughtered in front of them generally doesn't learn or grow from the experience in a positive way, but, instead, if fortunate, spends a long time just trying to return to their former state. Someone who starves to death knowing her children are next doesn't learn or grow from the experience.

Yes, my own trials might have made me stronger and helped me in real ways - but I have lived a horrendous-pain free life. Pretending my growth can or should apply to everyone is wrong.
I see through my glass, darkly - as I play my saxophone in harmony with the other instruments in God's orchestra. (h/t Elder Joseph Wirthlin)

Even if people view many things differently, the core Gospel principles (LOVE; belief in the unseen but hoped; self-reflective change; symbolic cleansing; striving to recognize the will of the divine; never giving up) are universal.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

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